Opinions on gun laws in your country

[Pyromaniac605]

Lately I've been thinking alot about gun laws, most likely in some part because I want to do target shooting when I'm older.

And it got me wondering what everyone else thinks about the gun laws in their country.

Personally I feel safe with the gun laws in Australia, and can walk around without being afraid of someone pulling a gun on me. (Not sure what good it'd do them anyway )
To own a gun in Australia you need to own a Permit To Acquire, which you must be 18 to get, the permit has a 28-day delay, which in some states is dropped for subsequent guns of the same category.

You must also give a genuine reason for owning a firearm, acceptable reasons are, pest control, hunting, target shooting or collecting, self-defense is not considered a genuine reason for obtaining a permit, although it is legal under certain circumstances to carry a firearm for self-defense.

The only thing that annoys me about our gun laws is the fact that Airsoft guns are banned, and it considered that there is no genuine reason to own an Airsoft gun. This annoys me because when I found out about Airsoft it looked like a far less painful and more enjoyable alternative to paintball, which I believe you need to be 18 to play in Victoria anyway.

So, how does everyone else feel about the gun laws in their country?

PS: Sorry for the long read.

 

[Silence]

I have so many complaints about Israel I don't even know where to start.

Knife and gun business was slipping out of control lately, to the government tightened the law to stupid levels. I'm more concerned about the ban to carry knives, but since the thread is about guns I'll focus on guns.

Here, if you're not a law enforcer you don't have a handgun. Soldiers carry M16s only, and the only people who carry handguns are security guards and police officers. I have never seen a civilian with a gun.
You never have to worry someone will pull out a pistol. Civilians are allowed to carry guns but the requirements are high - you have to be 21 and regularly go to a shooting range. Also if you ever had any kind of problems with the police involved you're rejected right away, as that's a part of the requirements. You must pass a mental health test which isn't cheap. You must live in Israel for at least 3 years. They wanna make sure you won't use that gun to harm anybody.

My personal opinion - bullsh*t. The law doesn't concern the real criminals, those who are ready to kill. Those people have their own sources and will probably obtain a firearm illegally. The result is that nobody has handguns, and those who do, aren't scared by the law. And if you ever mess up with one of those you don't have anything to protect yourself with.
I think the law should let us protect ourselves instead of being so tight.

I do not intend to carry a pistol at all times, but I do intend to carry a knife. Not as a weapon but as a tool. But this is banned too. If I get caught I must have a "decent reason" to have a knife on me. If I don't I get arrested.

But that's just me

 

[Ghostrider]

Swiss laws are sane, but laws always need to be balanced against one another...
For instance, to buy a gun in Switzerland you must be 18 and you need a buying permit (unless you're getting a bolt-action rifle) which covers pistols, shotguns and semiautomatic rifles or carbines. The permit is released by the cantonal (state) police and requires a clean criminal record. In the permit you must specify what your weapon will be used for (unless it's for hunting which requires a separate license, and competitive shooting which rules out a lot of weapons).

Now, a carry permit is another thing entirely. For starters, you need a good reason to get one (professional requirements for instance) and proof of that; then you need a clean criminal record (again) and both a theoretical and practical test which revolve around knowledge of Swiss laws pertaining to gun ownership, safety and personal defence, technical firearms knowledge and hands-on expertise including manipulations and practical shooting. Make one little mistake along the way (like letting your finger into the trigger guard when you're not in firing position) and say goodbye to your permit.

The big problem in Switzerland is that laws are generally too lenient towards violent crime: recently we had a big trial here for murder in the first degree (a particularly vicious case where the victim's body was also dismembered) and what did the perpetrator get? Nine years! The maximum you'll ever get is 15 years and you would need to nuke half of Switzerland to get it. We also lack any laws pertaining to criminal organizations' association, which is madness.

 

[jedidia]

For instance, to buy a gun in Switzerland you must be 18 and you need a buying permit (unless you're getting a bolt-action rifle) which covers pistols, shotguns and semiautomatic rifles or carbines. The permit is released by the cantonal (state) police and requires a clean criminal record. In the permit you must specify what your weapon will be used for (unless it's for hunting which requires a separate license, and competitive shooting which rules out a lot of weapons).

Let's not forgett to mention that all of this would make more sense if not every average male would be practically forced to keep a service-ready assault rifle at home... :lol:

 

[Silence]

Just wondering, if self defense isn't a good reason to carry a gun then what is? Isn't it what guns are made for?

 

[Ghostrider]

Let's not forgett to mention that all of this would make more sense if not every average male would be practically forced to keep a service-ready assault rifle at home... :lol:

Eh, used to be the Army did checks on you - you had a file on you from the moment you left recruitement way before you got into recruit school.

It was also the time your paperwork at the local offices got sped up a lot because if they lacked any info, they'd just phone to the relevant branch to get it.

Now, they cannot (officially) know anything about you that you haven't provided them in person, but if you had to do any paperwork to get into the Army, there would be the ticket out for anyone who didn't feel like it.

Just wondering, if self defense isn't a good reason to carry a gun then what is? Isn't it what guns are made for?

Target shooting, hunting, skeet shooting, pest control, performance art, you name it. Guns are made to shoot projectiles through a chemical reaction. What those projectiles do and where they go is up to you.

 

[Pyromaniac605]

The big problem in Switzerland is that laws are generally too lenient towards violent crime: recently we had a big trial here for murder in the first degree (a particularly vicious case where the victim's body was also dismembered) and what did the perpetrator get? Nine years!

Woah... that's insane... NINE YEARS!? :blink:

 

[PhantomCruiser]

Gun laws here in the United States can vary pretty widely depending on what state a person lives in.

Tennessee has enacted a policy of "shall issue" gun carry permits (within the last 15 years or so perhaps) prior to that you needed a valid reason to carry a firearm. "Shall issue" means that unless there the person has a criminal record, a history of medical disorder, or any complaint regarding domestic violence, then the State 'shall issue' his/her concealed carry permit after a state mandated/regulated safety class. Said class isn't waived because someone retired from the military after 20 years of service, then retired again from the police. Doesn't matter, everyone takes the class. Unless you're a Judge, for some reason they are waived. But most of them take the class anyway, it is a good idea.
The training class is informative to anyone who hasn't grown up around firearms. I live in what was a rural county. Hunting isn't uncommon, and though I haven't been in quite some time I do have several pounds of venison in my freezer. The class is broken down into classroom/lecture with a test that follows, and a practical on the gun range. Depending on the individual aptitude, there are several instructors that will 'work' with those who couldn't hit water if they fell out of a boat. But I do know instructors who won't pass someone who can't follow simple range rules and is visibly a danger to themselves with a gun... I think the main takeaway from the class is that an individual is legally, financially (and morally) responsible for the bullet once it leaves the barrel of the gun.
Once you have the certificate from the class, a person goes to the same place where people get their drivers license (after making an appointment to get fingerprinted), fill out a form, shell out $150 and the law enforcement guys do their background checks.

When Tennessee changed the law to "shall issue" there were a few groups (the anti-gun crowd) who argued against it, violent crime would increase, domestic violence would go up, shootouts in the streets, etc... Didn't happen. There were many people in my class getting their permit so that they could legally do what they'd been doing for years anyway. There are still more deaths from drunk driving, stabbings, etc. than shootings.
There are some crimes that have a stiffer penalty when (unlawful) possession of a firearm is added. For instance an individual in possession of narcotics, with the intent of distribution (aka a drug dealer) also is carrying a handgun concealed, then the penalty is escalated to a different level.

Ghostrider had a thread a while back that was pretty good. http://www.orbiter-forum.com/showthread.php?t=20123&highlight=concealed

 

[Chub777]

The only thing that annoys me about our gun laws is the fact that Airsoft guns are banned

What?! :suicide: (pun intended)I live and the same country and I never knew that. But I guess the good part is that you don't get shot randomly in the street.

 

[Pyromaniac605]

What?! :suicide: (pun intended)I live and the same country and I never knew that. But I guess the good part is that you don't get shot randomly in the street.

You wouldn't if they do what they've been doing with toy guns for years, add an orange tip, or, all things considered make the guns bright orange, something that clearly marks it as an Airsoft gun as opposed to a real one.

 

[Chub777]

You wouldn't if they do what they've been doing with toy guns for years, add an orange tip, or, all things considered make the guns bright orange, something that clearly marks it as an Airsoft gun as opposed to a real one.

True. A quick Google search confirmed that:

Same with those dart guns:

I always thought they were just design.

 

[Jarvitä]

Some of the most restrictive in Europe, and I'm absolutely fine with that. Firearms don't belong in a civilised society, period.

If firearms are banned, of course only criminals have them - that's the very definition of what happens when you ban something. The problem can't be tackled by letting everyone arm themselves - that amounts to the state saying "we can't do our duty to protect you, we cede authority". A state letting its citizens arm themselves like that is basically admitting it's weakness and inability to cope with crime. That isn't something to be praised.

 

[Ghostrider]

Depends on what your definition of "civilized" society is. The "civilized society" argument has been used against contact sports, comic books, computer games and teh interwebz as well. My idea of a civilized society is of one that respects the individual liberties of the citizen while also enforcing his responsabilities. Other like a faufreluches-like system that tells everybody what they can or cannot do - or else. The latter are free to live in Metropolis-land as long as they're about one parsec from me.

 

[Jarvitä]

My idea of a civilized society is of one that respects the individual liberties of the citizen while also enforcing his responsabilities.)

I imagine for most people, the freedom not to be shot at would slightly outweigh the freedom to carry around lethal weapons. And personal liberties should always end where social liberties begin.

 

[RisingFury]

Some of the most restrictive in Europe, and I'm absolutely fine with that. Firearms don't belong in a civilised society, period.

If firearms are banned, of course only criminals have them - that's the very definition of what happens when you ban something. The problem can't be tackled by letting everyone arm themselves - that amounts to the state saying "we can't do our duty to protect you, we cede authority". A state letting its citizens arm themselves like that is basically admitting it's weakness and inability to cope with crime. That isn't something to be praised.

AMEN!

 

[fireballs619]

I can only speak for myself here, but if I was in a situation where I was pitted against someone who had a gun, I would surely want to have a gun also. No use bringing a knife to a gun fight. Also, I disagree with the statement of

A state letting its citizens arm themselves like that is basically admitting it's weakness and inability to cope with crime.

I think a state that lets it's citizens arm itself is ultimately putting more power into the hands of the people. As crazy as it sounds, having a populace that is armed to the teeth makes it much harder to stamp out revolts, meaning the people can overthrow the government if need be. Sounds like I'm a nut when I read that, but its true :lol:. As Thomas Jefferson said

The beauty of the second amendment is that it won't be needed until they try to take it.

 

[Ark]

Personally I have no problem with gun laws as they are in the US. Guns are primarily designed for the expressed purpose of killing people, and therefore should be subject to appropriate regulation. But banning them just because "it serves no purpose and you don't need it"? Absolutely not. I have no legitimate reason to own a 5.2L V8-powered Chrysler instead of a Prius, but I want to because that's my hobby and I'm passionate about it. The "you don't need that" argument can be wielded against so many things in my life I love that I can't support using it against gun owners. I think that if people are properly screened and licensed, they should be free to enjoy their gun hobby just as anyone else is free to enjoy theirs.

 

[Ghostrider]

I imagine for most people, the freedom not to be shot at would slightly outweigh the freedom to carry around lethal weapons. And personal liberties should always end where social liberties begin.

You would be right at home with Franco Frattini, currently the Italian foreign minister, who when in Brussels stated that "the freedom not to be blown up outweighs your freedom to find information on the internet". He's one of the great advocates of internet censorship.

There are no "freedoms not to". Otherwise I'd like to weigh my "freedom not to get squashed by a 40-ton truck" against the "social liberty" to have fresh strawberries in winter.

However I wouldn't like to derail the thread into another guns yes/no debate. We're discussing local laws.

 

[PhantomCruiser]

Local(ish) laws. Yes, back to topic please.

Year before last in the next county over a little girl was mauled by a black bear in a State Park. To summarize; Mother human was walking a nature trail with two little ones. Mama bear (in defense of little cubs) took the encroachment in her area of responsibility and attacked one of the children (little boy) mama human ran to little boys defense. Mama bear ran off and attacked little girl.

This resulted in the State passing legislation to allow lawful gun owners (with carry permit) the ability to carry in State Parks. Arguments ensued about turning State parks into killing zones similar to the "shootout at the O.K. Corral". Amended legislation allows local counties to "opt-out" and continue the ban on guns in State parks within their county border. Several counties (mostly urban areas) took this option, but many in the rural areas did not. I don't have a graphic depicting which did and didn't, but I imagine the "opt-out" areas are centered around Memphis, Nashville, Knoxville and Chattanooga.

 

[Notebook]

Never had much interest in firearms, in the UK its just police, armed forces, farmers and gun clubs who carry guns legally(probaly others I don't know about).
Not much of a gun culture here, except for the usual scum-bags doing crime. Still gives me a bit of a jolt seeing armed police at airports, but I think I'm getting used to it.

We have had some horrific mass-killings:
[ame="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hungerford_massacre"]Hungerford massacre - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia[/ame]
[ame="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dunblane_massacre"]Dunblane massacre - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia[/ame]
[ame="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cumbria_shootings"]Cumbria shootings - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia[/ame]
Some call for stricter gun control, but most people understand these are severly disturbed individuals, not much legislation can do.

N.