Bush: worst president ever

simonpro

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Okay, time to remind myself that jokes don't work online :p

I wasn't saying Bush caused a recession, I wasn't even arguing that he had (although I think he hasn't exactly helped the situation). I was merely saying there's already indicators of a recession, be that the fault of Bush, Aliens or the Red Sox.
 

Usonian

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The Fed is very much like anti-virus software. It must constantly update to protect against the development of things that could raise havoc in the system under the current operating system. Once in a while one slips through and causes mayhem. In this role it really does not matter whether there is a Republican or Democrat in the White House.

I think it matters if the President is hostile to government regulation or favors it. I think it matters that ever since Reagan Republican presidents have been pursuing a course of borrow-and-spend big government - and calling that conservative!
 

Urwumpe

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Its the same in Germany. Our conservative party government from 1982 to 1998 raised the public debts of Germany from 237 billion to over 1009 billion. The current government only manages to make the debt increase stagnate.


Where the money went is also known. It ended in the hands of the big companies or got wasted for conceptless infrastructure programs after the reunification.

Only very little money invested that way actually ended in making a profit for the government by higher tax incomes. Not really what I consider conservative financial politics.

I think, any government, regardless if it is left, right, center or royalist, should have the duty to remember that they are not spending their own money, but the money of the citizens, and work extremely careful and responsible with it. Building a train bridge somewhere in the middle of Bavaria for 50 million €, which will not get used until 2020 and will cost 250 million € included maintenance, until it gets used, is not careful.
 

Dogsbd

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You don't have to be stupid, to do bad work? :p

Also, Bush II very likely did never have to hold a speech inside the F-102 cockpit. And somebody else told him what to do.

Read the entire bit:


f102-thumb.jpg


This is a Convair F-102 Delta Dagger. It is a second-generation, supersonic fighter-interceptor. It cruises at 845 mph.

There were some minor aerodynamic problems with the F-102. For example, at certain power settings and angles of attack, like, say, take-off -- the jet compressor would stall and the aircraft would roll inverted. It is no picnic, skill-wise, to fly a modern F-16 with advanced avionics and fly-by-wire flight control systems. The workload on the F-102 was far higher. The F-16 has an accident rate of 4.14 occurrences per 100,000 flight hours. The F-102's accident rate was more than three times that: 13.69 per 100,000 hours. 875 F-102A interceptors were built; 259, almost 30% - were lost to accidents or enemy action while serving in Vietnam.

George W. Bush flew hundreds of hours in the F-102.

Now look at this:

08-F-106A_Delta_Dart_cockpit_sim-thumb.jpg


This is the cockpit of the F-102 Delta Dagger's successor, the F-106 Delta Dart (I could not find an F-102 panel, but they would have been very similar)

Now, picture yourself in this chair, at 40,000 feet, traveling at one and a half times the speed of sound. Now imagine that someone has painted the windows white you are flying on instruments. Now imagine that not only do you have to be able to fly blind, by referencing these instruments, but that you also have to stare into that orange jack-o-lantern of a radar, and interpret a squiggle that will lead you to your target. Now imagine that in addition to not hitting the ground, or your wingman, and watching the squiggle, you also have to turn those switches on the right side panel to activate weapons systems, to overcome enemy countermeasures�without looking outside, as you hurtle through air at -40 degrees F, air so thin that should you lose pressure, you have about 4-6 seconds of consciousness before you black out and die.

I maintain that the instant George W. Bush closed that canopy and took off on the first of his many solo hours in an F-102, it is quite impossible that he was either an idiot or a coward.

Here is a random question from the instrument rating exam I had to pass a few years ago.

Refer to figure 91:
fig%2091-thumb.jpg


What should be the approximate elapsed time from the BOSEMAN (BZN) VOR to the DUBOIS (DBS) VORTAC if the wind is 24 knots from 260 degrees and your intended True Air Speed is 185 knots? (The magnetic variation is 17deg. E)

A. 33 minutes
B. 37 minutes
C. 39 minutes

(It's C., obviously)

If he had been a civilian rather than military pilot, Dubya would have had to have passed 60 questions like this with at least 70% correct. Questions on weather, radio communications, mechanical systems, aerodynamics, pilot physiology, airspace, navigation and a hundred other things. But, since he was military, he also had to know how to operate that primitive in-flight radar, plus weapons systems, rules of engagement, electronic warfare, hydraulics, fuel systems�it goes on and on.

People like Michael Moore and Bill Maher and Keith Olberman would not be able to figure out how to close the canopy on an F-102. These people would be weeping with fear when those afterburners light up and you barrel down that runway hoping that engine doesn't flame out and roll you inverted into the asphalt, or when you're rocketing through the soup at 300mph watching two little needles chase each other, praying the next thing you see out the window is a runway and not a mountain goat.

George W. Bush is not stupid. It's not possible to be a moron and fly a supersonic jet fighter, and everyone knows it.

What George W. Bush is, however, is inarticulate. English is his second language. From what I can see he does not have a first language. Abraham Lincoln spoke in simple frontier language in an age of rhetorical flourish. Like Bush, he was considered a bumpkin and an idiot, and like Bush, he realized that there were times when having people misunderestimate you repeatedly was a real advantage. That's goal-oriented. That's playing the deep game. That's cunning.

I personally have gotten to the point where Bush's malapropisms cause me to look at the floor and shake my head with an affectionate smile, in much the same way supporters of his predecessor used to do with every new revelation of coerced sex from former employees. He is what he is. But he is a damn sight more intelligent than the graphic designer in the Mini Cooper with the Village Idiot sticker. Me, personally, I look at the man's entire catalog of flaws in the same way Lincoln looked at Grant and his drinking: I can't spare this man. He fights.

So to me, anyway, given the above information I feel that anyone calling President Bush a moron and an idiot comes off sounding like, well, a moron and an idiot.

I did not write the above, but I agree with every single word.

WAR OF THE BUMPER STICKERS
 

Urwumpe

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I think you should not overestimate his skills. Also the author largely underestimates the skills of other people. The cockpit might look complex to somebody who only saw a SUV cockpit until that moment, but it is damn simplistic compared to buggers like the Concorde. Even a Cessna of today has not really less dials and gauges.

Also the air borne radar of that era was not really for locating the enemy over long distances. The F-14 bought this capability by having a guy sitting in the back of the pilot doing nothing else but staring into the magic orb.
The F-15 finally had what we today call a fighters radar - with complex filters and signal processors to squeeze any bit of information from the returned signals without bothering the pilot with doing that.

The F-102 radar only had two jobs - locate the opponent over medium distances and allow night fighting.

On the military service of George W Bush, I think all facts had been said and all are free to interpret it. He scored the lowest acceptable grade in his aptitude test to become pilot. If it wouldn't have been at the height of the Vietnam war and a demand for good pilots elsewhere, he would have become propeller cleaner with such a low score.

Also the number of solo flight hours does not seem to be high compared to US Air Force personal - the most favorable quote I found said once per week. When he flew really intercept training missions, he only flew about one hour per week. 100 hours in two years.

Most hobby pilots get more hours in that time, even if they have to pay the fuel and maintenance themselves.

Simulator training did not exist at that time, so you can say, he only flew often enough for staying capable of it. But he did not deserve any medals for this performance.
 

SethEden

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McCain and CEV

Lets not forget that McCain wants to put a spending freeze on NASA which would totally kill CEV development at it's most critical moment of design, exactly like what happened to the Shuttle in the late 70's and early 80's. This happens and you can bet we'll be stuck in LEO for another 20 years while China paints the moon red, followed shortly by India.

I'm for Clinton, she seems the most positive about the space program, now that I'm living in Rocket City it really would effect my life significantly!

Seth
 

GregBurch

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Lets not forget that McCain wants to put a spending freeze on NASA which would totally kill CEV development at it's most critical moment of design, exactly like what happened to the Shuttle in the late 70's and early 80's. This happens and you can bet we'll be stuck in LEO for another 20 years while China paints the moon red, followed shortly by India.

... well, if this thread wasn't incendiary enough already, I'll throw some hydrogen on that fire: Killing Orion would be one reason for me to support a candidate, since the sooner that ill-conceived abortion is put out of its misery, the better. Obama's statements in that direction would be laudable if they weren't so silly.

GB
 

Urwumpe

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I would appreciate any candidate, who kills Orion in favor of O'Keefes concept of using existing launch vehicles instead of developing everything new.

But I won't vote.
 

Urwumpe

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Why not? Just because you're German? Heck, some places here in the U.S., like Chicago, even dead people vote! At least you're still breathing, that's gotta count for something!:boss:

Hey, if McCain could possibly not become president because he was born in Panama while it was occup... liberated by the USA, how should I even register for voting? :rofl:
 

SethEden

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Orion

Well don't get me wrong I have my problems with the orion design, for one its FAR to big and heavy to land on the surface of Mars and return directly to Earth. But I guess that wasn't NASA's plan in the first place, since they took Zubrins plan and added the risk of a Mars orbit rendevous and docking to their Mars orbit stationed ERV.

My other problem is that they decided to build the engines using standard LH2 and LOX rather than making LCH4 and LOX as part of the ISRU system. However, I can see the reason for doing this to cut down on development costs, and development risk.

...but that's just me. I'm in favor of anything that will get us there even if I have issues with the designs.

Seth
 

Andy44

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Well don't get me wrong I have my problems with the orion design, for one its FAR to big and heavy to land on the surface of Mars and return directly to Earth.

Where does anyone get the idea that you're going to land a CSM on Mars and take off again? Where does this myth come from?
 

Urwumpe

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Where does anyone get the idea that you're going to land a CSM on Mars and take off again? Where does this myth come from?

From the Mars Direct ERV design, which still lives on as something else in the mars reference architecture?
 

adamb193

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I propose that we all just go off and make our own country, we could probally be on the moon in an year, and Mars in three.
 

n0mad23

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Anyone remember that Dan Quayle was "impeachment insurance"?

Danny-Boy actually seems like a bloody genius next to the imposter-in-chief. Yes, maybe he did fly a F-102, but I'd bet that the coke gave him the edge to make it possible.

Worst president ever - no doubt about it.
 

Usonian

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Read the entire bit:

...

I did not write the above, but I agree with every single word.

For the record, I never called Bush an idiot. I just called him the worst President ever.

Within any group of intelligent people there are a wide range of preferences, abilities, experiences and styles. (I am trying hard to avoid the trendy expression of "differing intelligences.") The intellectual skills needed to fly an aircraft are far different from those needed to be an effective President. The most important Presidential skill is articulation. A President without command of language has command of nothing at all.

The comparisons of Bush to Lincoln and Grant are entirely specious. Lincoln was falsely painted as a country bumpkin by his polished Eastern rivals... i.e. the kind of people who today summer at Kennebunkport and get legacy admissions to Yale:dry:

Besides pulling stumps and splitting rails, Lincon could quote Milton, Shakespeare, the Bible and Danial Webster at great length and with deep understanding, he read Euclid and taught himself geometry and surveying, he practiced law with great success, filed a patent for a riverboat shoal flotation device... it goes on and on... concluding with sole authorship of his Gettysburg Address and Second Inaugural - documents that elevated and redefined America.

U.S. Grant - in additon to drinking too much, failing at business and being an awful President - laid siege to Vicksburg, lifted a siege at Chattanooga and beat Robert E. Lee. While dying of throat cancer, Grant wrote his memoirs which were admired and published by no less a literary light than Mark Twain, and are considered a classic to this day.

Perhaps Bush II really is just being canny and hiding his light under a bushel. But who can tell? To date, he hasn't lifted the bushel and let his little light shine. To compare Bush with Lincoln and Grant is, well, idiotic.

--------

Going off the Off-Topic - and stricly off the top of my head - didn't I read somewhere that the current re-entry scheme for CEV is an ocean splashdown?? That would be sooo 20th century! Have we learned nothing from the Shuttle? Fund CEV fully or don't fund it at all.

When I firmly set aside my Orbiter astronaut fantasies, I would rather see money poured into fully funded unmanned spacecraft than a half-funded CEV.
 
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Urwumpe

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Going off the Off-Topic - and stricly off the top of my head - didn't I read somewhere that the current re-entry scheme for CEV is an ocean splashdown?? That would be sooo 20th century! Have we learned nothing from the Shuttle? Fund CEV fully or don't fund it at all.

When I firmly set aside my Orbiter astronaut fantasies, I would rather see money poured into fully funded unmanned spacecraft than a half-funded CEV.

The last I heard was the CEV using a land landing, but the service module being required to reenter over ocean.
 

DaveS

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The last I heard was the CEV using a land landing, but the service module being required to reenter over ocean.
It's a ocean-landing that's the baseline now. Land-landing is for contigency abort cases only.

Land-landings were removed from the baseline during the weight scrubbing efforts on Orion.
 

Urwumpe

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Land-landings were removed from the baseline during the weight scrubbing efforts on Orion.

Great. :dry: Now it is really just a ugly Apollo Mk 2. And reuse should get much more expensive. Well, that is NASA.

I hope NASA does not pay the current engineers, but instead the old engineers who worked on the Apollo project for that work.
 

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Jimmy Carter (who is a piece of excrement).

Appointed Ayatollah-lover Andrew Young as Ambassador to the U.N.

Then gave Iran to Ayatollahs. Which caused Sunni Wahabi reaction against resurgent Shia power.

Then let Iran hold hundreds of Americans hostage for over a year.

Also surrendered Panama Canal.

Destroyed United States' domestic oil production -- *directly responsible* for our dependence on foreign oil!

Created the Department of Energy to supervise the destruction of America's energy industries. We have not built a single petroleum refinery since Jimmy Carter (who is a piece of excrement).

Created the Department of Education to make sure nobody gets an education, graduating generations of Dummycrats who are too stupid to know that Jimmy Carter is a piece of excrement as well as the worst President ever.

And I apologize to all the good, fecund excrement in the world. Jimmy Carter, who is a piece of excrement, is a piece of universally poisonous stinking horror excrement.

Worst President Ever.
 
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