Update [obsolet] OrbiterSound 4.0 - dev thread

cipher169

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thank you dan for all of your hard work. you really made the orbiter experience even greater.:tiphat:

I just cant wait for this to come out. All my favorite addons getting updated, its like Christmas.
 

dansteph

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Does Orbiter Sound 4 support customized sounds based on altitude? You know I have long requested this for enhanced Scenario development.

Sorry still not, maybe for next version ?


Great thanks, I'll try it soon.

Dan

---------- Post added at 04:06 AM ---------- Previous post was at 12:13 AM ----------

DEV NEWS

Sorry there will be no 3d for the RCS thrusters.

I tried to add 4 rcs sound positioned at the correct rcs location. (front,left, rear, right) The result varied to exactly the same than 2d RCS (this is logic as they almost always fire by pairs) to worse due to resonances even when correcting phases and loading different sound.

The only benefit was in external view because the sound seemed to originate from the correct location. But that was only when I reduced a lot the 3d distance so sounds would not overlap and only in atmosphere when we need rarely the RCS. (Distance reduction mean you barely hear right rcs when the camera is near left wing) For a total of 8 sounds more (attack/sustain) and an increased complexity for the SDK (pos/replace of config file and C++) the (very to no) add doesn't worth it.

In anyway I added a new 3d retro thruster sound (previously it was the main thrust played with reduced volume) with separate parameters in config and SDK.
 
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N_Molson

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Very cool to be able to have different ambiences on different planets, I always found it was somehow lacking :thumbup:
 

RisingFury

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Up until (including) OrbiterSound 3.5, when one vessel makes a sound, it cannot be heard in another vessel. Will you fix that? Can the sound any vessel makes be heard in any other vessel?

If yes, will you implement effects like Doppler effect and not being able to hear the sound if you're moving away from the source at a velocity higher than the speed of sound?
 

dansteph

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Up until (including) OrbiterSound 3.5, when one vessel makes a sound, it cannot be heard in another vessel. Will you fix that? Can the sound any vessel makes be heard in any other vessel?

I tried that but it's a hell doing this with a central dll that should manage unknown number and type
of object with a lot of unknown data. And all this for a space simulator where 95% of time you don't
see any other vessel or you see them in space where there is no external sound.

I would also not be able to do that for more than six sound: thrusters,rcs and airspeed wind.
It would fall short for all special ship and would be a pain for computer if by any chance you have 20
vessel close in a scenario: With a complex vessel you might have 60 wav loaded+6*20= up to 180
sound loaded and processed.

We do not speak about someone that do for example cargos objects that meet the "vessel" trigger (thruster).
60+6*200=1260 sound to process.

The CPU price, bug risk for the tiny add of a rare third ship flyby simply doesn't worth it.

We should never say never but I'm afraid the chance we see such an OrbiterSound is really tiny.
The ratio efforts/risk/benefit is not favourable.
 
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Hlynkacg

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Feature Request:

Well two really.

Could you add an option for start and shutdown sounds to the main engine? Essentially handle them in the same manner as the RCS with a with an inititial "attack" sound followed by a "sustain".

Second, (and this is the one I would really like to see) could you please make it possible to assign an engine sound to specific thrusters rather than just thrustgroups?

This would be invaluable for vessels that have multiple types of engines that may or may not be assigned to a given Thrustgroup depending on the flight profile. I am thinking specifically of things like the SCRAM engines on a DG or XR class vessel or other cases where dummy and user-defined RCS groups are used as part of a custom control scheme.

In code terms I imagine something similar to the "AddExhaust()" function in the orbiter core.

For example...
AddThrusterSound( THRUSTERHANDLE, Start.wav, Stop.wav, Sustain.wav );

---------- Post added at 08:14 PM ---------- Previous post was at 08:11 PM ----------

Oh and keep up the good work.

As other's have already said, your addons OrbiterSound, UMMU, etcc... are truly essential. My hat's off to you. :tiphat:
 
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dansteph

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Well two really.

Could you add an option for start and shutdown sounds to the main engine? Essentially handle them in the same manner as the RCS with a with an inititial "attack" sound followed by a "sustain".

Second, (and this is the one I would really like to see) could you please make it possible to assign an engine sound to specific thrusters rather than just thrustgroups?

Sorry no, only a few vessels need this and this would almost double the code and the new configuration file for only 5% vessel without covering all the case. (B52?)

Such specific case are to be handled with the OrbiterSound SDK as there is in anyway no good simulation of such specific vessel without C++ code.


Dan
 

Hlynkacg

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Sorry no, only a few vessels need this and this would almost double the code and the new configuration file for only 5% vessel without covering all the case. (B52?)

Such specific case are to be handled with the OrbiterSound SDK as there is in anyway no good simulation of such specific vessel without C++ code.


Dan

Fair enough...

could you at least include a sample line of code in the new SDK.cpp file that gives the inputs required to mimic the default engine sound functionality so I can do it my self?

Thankyou again, I'm looking forward to the update. :thumbup:
 

dansteph

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Fair enough...
could you at least include a sample line of code in the new SDK.cpp file that gives the inputs required to mimic the default engine sound functionality so I can do it my self?

Well, I reworked completely the SDK header readme and sample to make it clear and straight as a breeze.
The sample give four working example of sounds dynamic, static and 3d. Covering special case
is outside of scope of the SDK's doc.

The sound SDK is a tool and the tutorial should show only how to handle it so it remain simple.
If you don't know how to use it to write a scramjet then you need more a C++/Orbiter SDK help. (No offence
intended, we all started one day, I bang my head every day seeing my OrbiterSound code dated ten year ago ;) )


Anyway it's really not difficult for someone with some C++ knowledge. Load engine sound at start then play it
LOOPED each frame with frequency and volume that depend of engine level (not going below idle of course).
Adding some cool stuff as start-up en shut-off sound should be easy also.

The hell is in detail: for example I use since years this simple code to make value increase/decrease smoothly
(but not linearly) to reach a target value. I use it everywhere, for O2 consumption, G factor, sound frequency etc. etc.

Code:
[COLOR="DarkGreen"]// dt is frame delta time, dTarget is Target to reach, dFrequency the sliding value
// this code goes in timestep, you can multiply dt before to make the slide faster or slower.[/COLOR]
dFrequency=(dFrequency*(1.0-dt))+(dTarget*dt);

Without such small knowledge simple things may become difficult. The best things to do is to ask for some code help in forums.
 
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RisingFury

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Sorry no, only a few vessels need this and this would almost double the code and the new configuration file for only 5% vessel without covering all the case. (B52?)


Dude, you're limiting what developers can do! Why limit an add-on deliberately? You're stalling the development of Orbiter's add ons...

The "You only fly one ship, it's not worth it" mentality is the reason why Orbiter doesn't have advanced AI yet, why it doesn't have ATC and other vessels flying around automatically!
 

dansteph

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Why limit an add-on deliberately? You're stalling the development of Orbiter's add ons.

It's a joke for a hidden camera ?

My 6 month effort for free this year is not enough for you so
you feel you have the right to spit in my face like this ?
You ask me more efforts dealing with very complicated code,
docs and files because you feel too lazy to write ten lines of code
using the SDK that was done for that purpose ? (load sound,
calculate frequency each frame using the line I posted above, play = ten lines
and you have full control to make heli, b52, DC whatever while a config
file would never give you such control even with hundred lines behind
the scene)


I was thinking to post some snippets of code "scramjet for dummy" here
but now I really wonder why I would do that ?

The "You only fly one ship, it's not worth it" mentality is the reason why Orbiter doesn't have advanced AI yet, why it doesn't have ATC and other vessels flying around automatically!

Sure, it's not because it take hundred hours of dev, it's only a 'mental' problem.
 
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BruceJohnJennerLawso

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Dude, you're limiting what developers can do! Why limit an add-on deliberately? You're stalling the development of Orbiter's add ons...

The "You only fly one ship, it's not worth it" mentality is the reason why Orbiter doesn't have advanced AI yet, why it doesn't have ATC and other vessels flying around automatically!

Well from what Ive heard, your team is doing terrific work on getting us that AI for vessels, so no need to worry about that. Maybe just make a note of it somewhere & file it away for a future project. At the risk of starting a bombardment of your inbox Dan, why not just have addon devs send you UMMU/UCGO/Orbitersound feature requests in PMs/MPs, you make a list of the ones that are reasonable, and tick off a few items on the list with each new release.

Lets attack the code not each other :compbash2:
 

Zatnikitelman

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Actually, unless I misread what Dan said, he said that the config file wouldn't allow for that but using the API might would. AKA, the .dll is mightier than the .cfg.
 

dansteph

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Actually, unless I misread what Dan said, he said that the config file wouldn't allow for that but using the API might would. AKA, the .dll is mightier than the .cfg.

Yep, that was almost crystal clear in this post:

Such specific case are to be handled with the OrbiterSound SDK as there is in anyway no good simulation of such specific vessel without C++ code.Dan

I have absolutely no problems with requests and I never had any problems on this forum which is very friendly.
If one can just keep the uneducated kid out of my way so I can continue to "limit what developers can do"
work quietly all will be smooth as silk. (I usually hardly take offence but there is a limit)

----------------------------------------------

Would someone be kind to correct the texts of the vessel config file and/or let me know if it's clear ?
Please correct the whole text so I can past it directly in the config (without chasing correction one by one).
It might be better to announce you'll do it first so nobody do a duplicate work.

Much thanks :cheers:

Code:
////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////
// ORBITER 4.0 (3D) - SOUND CONFIGURATION FOR VESSEL CLASS
// -------------------------------------------------------
//
// IMPORTANT NOTE:
//
// -Line with '//' before are commented (inactive), uncomment and set value if you want to use them.
//
// -Sound configuration filename can be found in "Orbiter/OrbiterSound_Log.txt". You'll
//  have a message "Info: No sound config found for class: XXXXXX". Create and name your file 
//  "XXXXXX.cfg". If you replace sounds, "XXXXXX" will be also the name of the folder that must
//  contain your wavs. ie: "Orbiter/Sound/_CustomVesselsSounds/XXXXXX/".
//
// -This config file have higher priority over programmation and user settings. ie: you can therefore 
//  overwrite one addon's C++ settings and sounds and also user's settings.
//
// -Make sure to read each section's header; they explain all you have to know about parameters.
//
// -If you have any problem (eg: sound not playing) remember to take a look in OrbiterSound's log
//  located in the main Orbiter's directory (OrbiterSound_Log.txt)
//
// -Good sounds can enhance the visual by 200%, so take time and test, test and test again.
//
/////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////


//DISPLAYDEBUGHELP	=true	// This write many info in the OrbiterSound_Log.txt to help you
				// developing your sound addon: camera offset, parameters found etc.
				// A screen display "SOUND DEBUG ON" show to recall to disable this 
				// display before release.


/////////////////////////////////////////////////////
// General option for vessel
// -------------------------
// While some settings are very usefull some make sense only 
// into C++ SDK because for example disabling main thrust is 
// used by authors to play manually custom engines (which you cannot do). 
// In anyway here they are all, even the useless might prove their utility in the future.
// Note: -parameters have the same name than in C++ SDK
//	 -Those setting overwrite C++ SDK and user's setting.	
/////////////////////////////////////////////////////

PLAYCOUNTDOWNWHENTAKEOFF	=false	// the countdown of apollo11 when you take off
//PLAYWHENATTITUDEMODECHANGE	=true	// play "rotation" "linear" sound when you change mode
//PLAYGPWS			=true	// the GPWS sound
//PLAYMAINTHRUST		=true	// main thrust sound
//PLAYHOVERTHRUST		=true	// the hover thrust sound
//PLAYRETROTHRUST		=true	// the retro thrust
//PLAYATTITUDETHRUST		=true	// the attitude thrust sound
//PLAYDOCKINGSOUND		=true	// the docking sound and radio
//PLAYRADARBIP			=true	// the radar bip when near another vessel
//PLAYWINDAIRSPEED		=true	// the wind airspeed when atmosphere
//PLAYDOCKLANDCLEARANCE		=true	// the landing clearance you can hear bellow 3000m or near a station
//PLAYLANDINGANDGROUNDSOUND	=true	// Rolling, landing, speedbrake, crash sound
//PLAYCABINAIRCONDITIONING	=true 	// play the air conditionning sound
//PLAYCABINRANDOMAMBIANCE	=true	// play the random pump and rumble sound
//PLAYWINDAMBIANCEWHENLANDED	=true	// play the wind sound when landed
//PLAYRADIOATC			=true	// play the atc radio sound
//DISPLAYTIMER			=false	// display the timer text at the bottom of the screen when you take-off

/////////////////////////////////////////////////////
// Replace default sounds of vessel
// -------------------------------
// Here you can replace many sounds of the vessel with your own.
//
// IMPORTANT: 	All your custom wav must be placed in "Sound/_CustomVesselsSounds/[VesselclassName] folder.
// 		Example: "Sound/_CustomVesselsSounds/DeltaGlider/" for Deltaglider.cfg. 
//		ELSE THEY WILL NOT LOAD. (create the folder if it doesn't exist)
//		
//		ALL sounds must be PCM (uncompressed) wav 16 bits, OrbiterSound is set to
//		play at 22050hz, so higher frequency is only a waste of place.
//
//		Some sounds frequency are controlled by OrbiterSound, this is the case for 
//		example of the main engine which is played at differents frequency in 
//		internal or external view. Before replacing a sound it's a good idea to 
//		look first the frequency of the default wav. (in "Sound/Vessel")
//
// Note: -parameters have the same name than in C++ SDK
//       -If you don't know what a sound is for: launch Orbiter/SoundConfig.exe and click "test" buttons
/////////////////////////////////////////////////////

REPLACE_MAIN_THRUST		= main.wav	// MUST BE STEREO FOR GOOD RESULT IN 3D (and 2d)
REPLACE_HOVER_THRUST		= hover.wav	// MUST BE STEREO FOR GOOD RESULT IN 3D (and 2d)
REPLACE_RETRO_THRUST		= retro.wav	// MUST BE STEREO FOR GOOD RESULT IN 3D (and 2d)
REPLACE_AIR_CONDITIONNING	= aircond.WAV	// MUST BE STEREO FOR GOOD RESULT IN 3D (and 2d)
//REPLACE_RCS_THRUST_ATTACK	=		// MUST BE STEREO FOR LOCALISED RCS IN 3D (see note below)
//REPLACE_RCS_THRUST_SUSTAIN	=		// MUST BE STEREO FOR LOCALISED RCS IN 3D (see note below)
//REPLACE_COCKPIT_AMBIENCE_1	=		// played only mono in 3d.
//REPLACE_COCKPIT_AMBIENCE_2	=		// played only mono in 3d.
//REPLACE_COCKPIT_AMBIENCE_3	=		// played only mono in 3d.
//REPLACE_COCKPIT_AMBIENCE_4	=		// played only mono in 3d.
//REPLACE_COCKPIT_AMBIENCE_5	=		// played only mono in 3d.
//REPLACE_COCKPIT_AMBIENCE_6	=		// played only mono in 3d.
//REPLACE_COCKPIT_AMBIENCE_7	=		// played only mono in 3d.
//REPLACE_COCKPIT_AMBIENCE_8	=		// played only mono in 3d.
//REPLACE_COCKPIT_AMBIENCE_9	=		// played only mono in 3d.
//REPLACE_MODE_ATTITUDEOFF	=		// mono, radio play "Attitude off" when you change rcs mode
REPLACE_MODE_ROTATION		= rotation.wav // mono, radio play "rotation" when you change rcs mode
REPLACE_MODE_TRANSLATION	= translation.wav// Mono, radio play "translation" when you change rcs mode
//REPLACE_WIND_AIRSPEED		=		// MUST BE STEREO FOR GOOD RESULT IN 3D (and 2d)
//REPLACE_LAND_TOUCHDOWN	=		// Mono wheel ground contact (skreech)
//REPLACE_GROUND_ROLL		=		// MUST BE STEREO FOR GOOD RESULT IN 3D (and 2d)
//REPLACE_WHEELBRAKE		=		// MUST BE STEREO FOR GOOD RESULT IN 3D (and 2d)
//REPLACE_CRASH_SOUND		=		// MUST BE STEREO FOR GOOD RESULT IN 3D (and 2d)
//REPLACE_DOCKING		=		// Mono or stereo the docking sound effect
//REPLACE_UNDOCKING		=		// Mono or stereo the undocking sound effect
//REPLACE_RADIOLANDCLEARANCE	=		// Mono the "your are cleared to land" announce (armed >10000 played <3000)
//REPLACE_RADIO_DOCKING		=		// Mono the docking radio announce
//REPLACE_RADIO_UNDOCKING	=		// Mono the undocking radio announce
//REPLACE_RADAR_APPROACH	=		// Mono, the 2001 Odyssey "bip"
//REPLACE_RADAR_CLOSE		=		// Mono, the 2001 Odyssey close "bip"

//REPLACEALLGPWSSOUND		= true		// Mono, if true you must provide all the 12 GPWS sound in your folder.
						// (ie: -10.wav, to -2500.wav see "/vessel/" folder)


// NOTE ABOUT 3D LOCALISED RCS: (REPLACE_RCS_THRUST_ATTACK & REPLACE_RCS_THRUST_SUSTAIN)
// -----------------------------
// The 3D RCS use 8 sounds (4xstereo) but might fail in ship that have special RCS position, 
// if the result is not good you can force deactivating 3D RCS and revert to 2D RCS by 
// providing mono wav. (either attack, sustain or both, I recommend only attack)


/////////////////////////////////////////////////////
// 3d sound position
// -------------------------------
// By default the 3d positions of the sounds are calculated; for example the main engine position 
// is an average of all main thrusters and the two sounds (stereo) are offseted left and right
// for a better result.
//
// But the calculation might be inacurate; so you can fix here the position.
//
// Some other sounds position are calculated in "Pseudo random position". This mean 
// vessel's class name is used to generate a logic random position wich is always the same. 
// Example: the position of the radio sound will always be the same for a vessel type
// ( the radio instrument don't move in reality but it might be different for another vessel type)
//
// The ambient sounds are also automatically spread in "pseudo random position" around defaut camera 
// (pump and switch don't move also)
//
// Sound position are in X,Y,Z LOCAL VESSEL COORDINATE (internal cockpit sound must take in account
// the camera offset position; see debug parameter in top of this config file to get its value).
//
/////////////////////////////////////////////////////

//3dMainThrustPos	={0,0,0}{0,0,0}	// left/right channel (in case of stereo)
//3dHoverThrustPos	={0,0,0}{0,0,0}	// left/right channel (stereo, in this case front/rear offset give better results)
//3dRetroThrustPos	={0,0,0}{0,0,0}	// left/right channel (in case of stereo)
3dRcsFrontRearPos	={0,0,10}{0,0,-7}// Front rear RCS position, the sound must be stereo ! (see note below)
//3dRcsLeftRightPos	={0,0,0}{0,0,0}	// Left right RCS position, the sound must be stereo ! (see note below)
//3dAircondPos		={0,0,0}{0,0,0}	// left/right channel (in case of stereo)
//3dCockpitAmbience1Pos	={0,0,0}	// mono
//3dCockpitAmbience2Pos	={0,0,0}	// mono
//3dCockpitAmbience3Pos	={0,0,0}	// mono
//3dCockpitAmbience4Pos	={0,0,0}	// mono
//3dCockpitAmbience5Pos	={0,0,0}	// mono
//3dCockpitAmbience6Pos	={0,0,0}	// mono
//3dCockpitAmbience7Pos	={0,0,0}	// mono
//3dCockpitAmbience8Pos	={0,0,0}	// mono
//3dCockpitAmbience9Pos	={0,0,0}	// mono
//3dWindAirspeedPos	={0,0,0}{0,0,0}	// left/right channel (in case of stereo)
//3dLandTouchDownPos	={0,0,0}	// mono
//3dGroundRollPos	={0,0,0}{0,0,0}	// left/right channel (in case of stereo)
//3dWheelBrakePos	={0,0,0}{0,0,0}	// left/right channel (in case of stereo)
//3dCrashSound		={0,0,0}{0,0,0}	// left/right channel (in case of stereo)
//3dRadioPos		={0,0,0}	// Set pos for all radio sound: Rcs mode,clearance, dock/undock,radar, ATC chatter.
//3dGPWSPos		={0,0,0}	// Set pos for all GPWS sound.

// NOTE ABOUT DOCK/UNDOCK:
// -----------------------
// Dock/undock sound effects are at the exact docks position calculated during 
// dock/undock (up to 9 dock). A manual setting would have been to complicated, 
// so sorry you cannot set the dock/undock position.

// NOTE ABOUT 3D RCS:
// ------------------
// The automatic guess of RCS's position might fail because the exhaust thruster position 
// is not available in SDK and the logic position is often not at the exhaust point.
// You can try to position them manually in this case.
//
// 4 independant sound for RCS correctly positionned was possible at the expense of volume 
// and dynamic (without volume reduction they overlap and give bad harmonics). If you don't
// like this effect for your ship (or if RCS are not standard cross positionned) you can deactivate
// it by replacing stereo wav by mono. See above: "NOTE ABOUT 3D POSITIONED RCS".

And while we are here let me know if you see some errors here ;)

orbitersound40config.jpg
 
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Cras

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A few in the 4.0 config program window.

I recommend changing 3d to 3D. I am not sure if either is proper, its just a preference on my part.

Allow 3d RCS positioning

Play cabin air conditioning

Found 14/16 waves in folder....

Allow radio black-out during reentry

Display a T+time counter at launch for 300s.

Don't warn me about outdated addons that use 2.5 sdk.


Cheers, and thanks for all the hard work! :thumbup:
 

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At the end of the day, they are Dan's addon's and he has earned the right using his own time and expertise to do with them whatever he wants.

If you don't like it, no one is forcing anyone to download them.

I'm just grateful that developers are willing to share the fruits of their labour, Martins included :tiphat:

:hailprobe:
 

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Some more still from the config window - first line=original text, second line=suggested correction:

Warning: the new per vessel configurations files
Warning: the new per-vessel configuration files

priority over somes settings
priority over some settings

See doc click Help below
See doc - click Help below

You can edit thoses files
You can edit those files

Click below for upgrade and more download
Click below for upgrades and more downloads

Vacuum reduce internal engine
Vacuum reduces internal engine

Play when Attitude mode change
Play when Attitude mode changes

Play wind airspeed sound when atmosphere
Play wind airspeed sound when in atmosphere

Play wind ambience when landed and atmosphere
Play wind ambience when landed and in atmosphere
 
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