Local Space Transportation System Redux

[Arrowstar]

Now THAT looks fun.

 

[Sherrif of Nottingham]

Greg... your self taught, and use model detail instead of textures? That sounds like me.

Either way, your WAYY better than me and I really love your addons, I just wish that they were their own .dll ships. I love the way you use spacecraft, but for some of the vessels (even if somebody else does them thats fine) the .dll would be nice so I can just add them, several of them if I need to.

Don't you dare stop making addons.

 

[Sherrif of Nottingham]

Does the new Medium Utility Lander have a name like the Gilgamesh? Or shall I lovingly call it the Mule? (Medium Utility Lander Extraordinary)

 

[willy88]

Does the new Medium Utility Lander have a name like the Gilgamesh? Or shall I lovingly call it the Mule? (Medium Utility Lander Extraordinary)

What about Einherjar?

 

[GregBurch]

Greg... your self taught, and use model detail instead of textures? That sounds like me.

Either way, your WAYY better than me and I really love your addons, I just wish that they were their own .dll ships. I love the way you use spacecraft, but for some of the vessels (even if somebody else does them thats fine) the .dll would be nice so I can just add them, several of them if I need to.

Don't you dare stop making addons.

Thanks for your kind words. I'd say I use both textures and mesh elements for fine details. One thing I've discovered in the last few months is that a couple of hundred extra polygons in detailing doesn't really add very much at all in terms of rendering drag, but if carefully chosen as to where and what you add, increases the realism a lot.

As for .dll-ing ... it just ain't gonna happen. I know this really frustrates some people, but it's a simple function of being in what economists call a "high-level equilibrium trap." I'm still scaling a "local maximum" (to use a term from evolutionary theory), and simply can't stand the thought of the deep valleys that surround this region of self-developed expertise. The only hope is a deus ex machina like SC3 -- salvation being offered by some deity that will develop an engine for clear-text building .dll-s.

Does the new Medium Utility Lander have a name like the Gilgamesh? Or shall I lovingly call it the Mule? (Medium Utility Lander Extraordinary)

Nope, no names. It's like the BSP, just a utilitarian designation. For some reason, I have this feeling that only deep space vessels get names. It's irrational but ...there it is.

I do like "MULE" -- I wish I'd thought of it.

Finally, despite spending waaaaaay too much time writing posts on politics in off-topic threads, here's a pic indicating at least a little more progress on the heavy lander:

 

[pattersoncr]

...I do like "MULE" -- I wish I'd thought of it

I thought you did. I figured you had MULE in mind all along since it's called the Medium Utility Lander. You should learn to snatch credit when it's laid out like that.

Also, I took the lander for a spin from Heinlein upto the Gilgamesh waiting in orbit. My first attempt was with LOLA Mfd, which ended badly. The autopilot lifted up a hundred meters or so with the hovers, pitched vertical and proceeded to ride the main engines all the way to the ground.
My second attempt was better; Launch as the target passes overhead, lift off to 100m, pitch down to 50deg, pitch 70deg at 10km, 85deg at 20km then cut the hovers when ApA = 100km. Next I used transfer MFD to set-up a rendezvous burn near apoapsis (skipping the circularization burn) and IMFD DeltaV program to execute it (remember to select hover engines on the IMFD main menu). IMFD velocity match was used for the braking burn.

Keep up the great work Greg!

 

[dougkeenan]

As for .dll-ing ... it just ain't gonna happen. I know this really frustrates some people, but it's a simple function of being in what economists call a "high-level equilibrium trap." I'm still scaling a "local maximum" (to use a term from evolutionary theory), and simply can't stand the thought of the deep valleys that surround this region of self-developed expertise. The only hope is a deus ex machina like SC3 -- salvation being offered by some deity that will develop an engine for clear-text building .dll-s.

Have you ever teamed up? Someone else does the DLL leaving you free to handle the overall concept, design, and meshes?

 

[Sherrif of Nottingham]

I don't blame you for using SC3, I just wish the interface was more... helpful to people who want 2 Mules or something like that. As a matter of fact I was just about to start trying to develop a "modular" system, SC3 would be the only way for me to do it. But with school and all, making an addon might take months.

Also, truthfully, if you want to use mule i really don't care, I just don't want to type Medium Utility Lander every time I refer to it. Of course that would probably require you to change alot of documentation\images\files, so whatever.

Don't the space shuttles have names? What about Apollo? Gemini? I just figured that it would have a name, I was just wondering if it had one designated already.

Anyway, I guess I should learn how to texture better.

 

[GregBurch]

Less politics, more addon development:

My second attempt was better; Launch as the target passes overhead, lift off to 100m, pitch down to 50deg, pitch 70deg at 10km, 85deg at 20km then cut the hovers when ApA = 100km. Next I used transfer MFD to set-up a rendezvous burn near apoapsis (skipping the circularization burn) and IMFD DeltaV program to execute it (remember to select hover engines on the IMFD main menu). IMFD velocity match was used for the braking burn.

That's how I do it, except without all that fancy IMFD help. If people around here knew how I really navigate in space, it would be the final demise of my last shreds of credibility.

Have you ever teamed up? Someone else does the DLL leaving you free to handle the overall concept, design, and meshes?

Once, and very successfully. The X-15 addons were all a complete team effort between Scott Conklin and me. What's amazing is that when we started, neither of us had a clue about what we were doing. I built all the models and wrote about 30-40% of the documentation, Scott did all the technical research, all the flight parameter specification and 100% of the production of the superb documentation that comes with the X-15 addons.

Three things make me have significant doubts about engaging in a similar collaboration on my "future history" addons. First, the X-15 addons had historical reality as a grounding, which served as a common focus for Scott and I. Without that, I don't know if the second factor would have been possible, which was that Scott and I achieved a kind of Vulcan mind-meld on the project. We never disagreed about anything and, by the end, were basically working as one person. Given that I have a very significant and clear idea about what I'm doing with these addons on a "macro" scale, I'm not sure I could achieve such a rewarding merger of effort and goals with them. Finally, and most importantly, the X-15 addons are SC3 addons. When we started with them, I probably had a little more knowledge and skill with SC3 than Scott did although by the end, he was way past me). The point is that we both knew the coding milieu in which we were working. If I got into a collaboration with someone on C+ coding for .dlls, I wouldn't have that, and it would make things harder for me.

Bottom line: I doubt anyone would be willing to enslave themselves to my design direction the way I'd want with these addons, and that wasn't a factor with the X-15 addons, for the reasons I've described above.

 

[Sherrif of Nottingham]

Very nice heavy lander, looks good!

Didn't I remember seeing somebody say they would try to make .dll's out of your addons?

 

[Sherrif of Nottingham]

Bit of a problem with the Mule, whenever I attach a hab module normally to it, the module turns and goes through it sideways

Picture...


I do realize that it was not "built" for lifting these up, (If I'm not mistaken then the up-n'-coming heavy lander is more built for this) but I've got two things I do with "tools" I use them for what they were meant to do, then find new uses for them. Besides the gear being a little to short (and the rotated problem), it works perfectly!

 

[GregBurch]

Back to work -- sort of. I'm basically done with the modeling

Now comes the tedious part ... T-minus two weeks(?)

 

[GregBurch]

Final release package testing underway. Release scheduled for tomorrow morning, CDT.

A teaser:

 

[Major Tom]

Wow. Looks good!

 

[Sherrif of Nottingham]

Sweet! This should solve my rotation problem... Finnaly a way to build a space station in lunar orbit!

Not to be too... Needy, but is there a new tractor coming out? Or the orbital taxi? I was just wondering if the redux is creating different ships that achieve the same basic goals of the origionals. (midway through I said" forget spelling")and are the work pods part of the old or new?

 

[Arrowstar]

Oooo, pretty. Greg, you are the man. I'm going to have to get my lunar infrastructure up and running again with this vessel, maybe park a BSP or SwiftSS (my favorite!) there as well. Thanks!

Any idea what we can expect in the Redux program after this? Of course, you are MORE than entitled to a nice break after the fantastic work we've been seeing lately.

 

[GregBurch]

Now available at Orbit Hangar:

[ame="http://www.orbithangar.com/searchid.php?ID=3608"]Local Space heavy Utility Lander[/ame]

As for what comes after this, I'm pretty sure next I'll make the ground-handling tractor for the two new landers. Regarding the other questions, all the elements of the original LSTS addons will eventually be redone, as will Heinlein, along with some other things. I'm trying to be as systematic and consistent as I can be here in cislunar space before I move on out -- to Mars, the Belt and eventually to the place I've been dropping hints about in my documentation...

 

[dougkeenan]

Thanks for releasing this, can't wait to give it a whirl once I get home.

Quick question, top of the readme file, "LOCAL SPASE TRANSPORTATION" - is that an in-joke of some sort?

eta: Yay! First trip from Heinlein to Brighton no trouble at all, consuming about 60% of fuel. Absolutely beautiful mesh work Greg. (Is that a robot pilot?!) Your addons are so bright and colorful and always look so good against the lunar surface.

(photo: this is probably already known but you can land with the gear up)

Anyway excellent work! Still setting the bar high.

 

[Woo482]

I cant believe I have not used the new local space transportation addons yet. I have used all your old ones but not these ones I think i am going to download them and try and get them to
the moon
EDIT1:yes the spell checker is working !!

 

[pattersoncr]

...eta: Yay! First trip from Heinlein to Brighton no trouble at all, consuming about 60% of fuel...

LOLA MFD works great for sub orbital transfers like that.

(photo: this is probably already known but you can land with the gear up)

That's a Spacecraft3 thing.