Flight Question ISS Docking Is Too Realisic

[AssemblyLanguage]

I have two joysticks emulating the RHC and THC on the stock space shuttle. Docking with the ISS works fine but it is too real. At the risk of going against the Orbiter Prime Directive, I'd like to make it less real. I'm thinking of using this with kids and decrease the difficulty and time to completion.

I have Artlav's autopilot in reserve for those that give up.

I'm working on a script to automatically change the time warp as a function of distance.

I plan to automate the rotational and let the kids control the translational. I'll look at the Artlav's autopilot or another MFD that will maintain attitude.

An idea is to increase the docking port's distance considered a success or add some "magnetism" to the port.

Thoughts?

 

[Urwumpe]

What is too realistic there?

Have you looked at Rendezvous MFD ? It predicts the trajectory relative to the station.

I think you underestimate what children can do, when you properly explain, why this is harder than expected - children lack patience, but still love challenges. Docking is no mystery at all: The closer you get, the less rocket science you need.

Maybe you need some better planning aids there, which are not as technical as the usual Orbiter MFD.

 

[kamaz]

Two points:

1. Kids are actually smart enough to learn to fly a 737. I wouldn't go dumbing down things until they actually demonstrate that they are unable to cope.

2. In my opinion, docking difficulty in orbiter has more to do with the controller than with the maneuver itself. After the rotation is matched, it is simply a matter of keeping DockingMFD markers aligned. You don't need any genius to move the spacecraft in the direction pointed by the yellow arrow -- you need an intuitive and responsive controller. Here is my solution for a docking controller..

---------- Post added at 08:47 PM ---------- Previous post was at 08:39 PM ----------

Also -- MFD refresh rate at least 10Hz or higher.

 

[ADSWNJ]

Have a look at RV Orientation. You can enable rotational AP control, and manually fly the translation, or enable both rotational and left-right/up-down AP control and manually fly the forward approach, or sit back and watch the whole approach run automatically. You also get a set of waypoints around the target to fly a safe distance until you get to the docking corridor.

 

[RonDVouz]

If you want easy try Kerbal. It's specifically designed for kids.

For me I like the realism. If it was too easy then it wouldn't be fun.

What joystick did you use for the linear control? Did it have the twist function?

 

[Shifty]

If you want easy try Kerbal. It's specifically designed for kids.

Guess I'm a 37 year old kid then. I feel like KSP was specifically designed with me in mind

 

[RonDVouz]

Fair enough.

About that joystick, the one you use for LIN control did you have to assign the functions or was it as simple as plugging it in?

 

[kamaz]

Fair enough.

About that joystick, the one you use for LIN control did you have to assign the functions or was it as simple as plugging it in?

Plug it in (DON'T install manufacturer's software), then configure it with this addon: [ame="http://orbithangar.com/searchid.php?ID=3223"]Fly-By-Wire 0.9.1 beta[/ame]

Below is the config file goes into orbiter\FlyByWire\Current\ProfileStandard.ini :

[Aileron]
Primary.Conversion.Type=standard
Primary.Conversion.Func=0.00000,0.00000;1.00000,1.00000
Primary.Conversion.Inverted=0
Primary.Conversion.MirrorFuncXY=0
Primary.Conversion.LowerDeadzone=-1.00
Primary.Conversion.UpperDeadzone=-1.00
Primary.Conversion.LowerCenterDeadzone=-1.00
Primary.Conversion.UpperCenterDeadzone=-1.00
Primary.Input.Device=[T.Flight Hotas X]
Primary.Input.InputType=axis
Primary.Input.InputNumber=0
[Elevator]
Primary.Conversion.Type=standard
Primary.Conversion.Func=0.00000,0.00000;1.00000,1.00000
Primary.Conversion.Inverted=0
Primary.Conversion.MirrorFuncXY=0
Primary.Conversion.LowerDeadzone=-1.00
Primary.Conversion.UpperDeadzone=-1.00
Primary.Conversion.LowerCenterDeadzone=-1.00
Primary.Conversion.UpperCenterDeadzone=-1.00
Primary.Input.Device=[T.Flight Hotas X]
Primary.Input.InputType=axis
Primary.Input.InputNumber=1
[Elevator trim]
Primary.Conversion.Type=standard
Primary.Conversion.Func=0.00000,0.00000;1.00000,1.00000
Primary.Conversion.Inverted=0
Primary.Conversion.MirrorFuncXY=0
Primary.Conversion.LowerDeadzone=-1.00
Primary.Conversion.UpperDeadzone=-1.00
Primary.Conversion.LowerCenterDeadzone=-1.00
Primary.Conversion.UpperCenterDeadzone=-1.00
Primary.Input.Device=[]
Primary.Input.InputType=none
Primary.Input.InputNumber=-1
[Hover engine]
Primary.Conversion.Type=standard
Primary.Conversion.Func=0.00000,0.00000;1.00000,1.00000
Primary.Conversion.Inverted=0
Primary.Conversion.MirrorFuncXY=0
Primary.Conversion.LowerDeadzone=-1.00
Primary.Conversion.UpperDeadzone=-1.00
Primary.Conversion.LowerCenterDeadzone=-1.00
Primary.Conversion.UpperCenterDeadzone=-1.00
Primary.Input.Device=[T.Flight Hotas X]
Primary.Input.InputType=button
Primary.Input.InputNumber=5
[Main engine]
Primary.Input=axis;2;[T.Flight Hotas X]
Primary.Conversion.Type=standard
Primary.Conversion.Func=0.00000,0.00000;1.00000,1.00000
Primary.Conversion.Inverted=1
Primary.Conversion.MirrorFuncXY=0
Primary.Conversion.LowerDeadzone=-1.00
Primary.Conversion.UpperDeadzone=-1.00
Primary.Conversion.LowerCenterDeadzone=-1.00
Primary.Conversion.UpperCenterDeadzone=-1.00
RetroMode=1
RetroBtn.Input=button;4;[T.Flight Hotas X]
RetroButton.Conversion.Type=standard
RetroButton.Conversion.Func=0.00000,0.00000;1.00000,1.00000
RetroButton.Conversion.Inverted=0
RetroButton.Conversion.MirrorFuncXY=0
RetroButton.Conversion.LowerDeadzone=-1.00
RetroButton.Conversion.UpperDeadzone=-1.00
RetroButton.Conversion.LowerCenterDeadzone=-1.00
RetroButton.Conversion.UpperCenterDeadzone=-1.00
[RCS Lin X]
Primary.Conversion.Type=standard
Primary.Conversion.Func=0.00000,0.00000;1.00000,1.00000
Primary.Conversion.Inverted=1
Primary.Conversion.MirrorFuncXY=0
Primary.Conversion.LowerDeadzone=-1.00
Primary.Conversion.UpperDeadzone=-1.00
Primary.Conversion.LowerCenterDeadzone=-1.00
Primary.Conversion.UpperCenterDeadzone=-1.00
Primary.Input.Device=[T.Flight Hotas X]
Primary.Input.InputType=hat E-W as axis
Primary.Input.InputNumber=0
[RCS Lin Y]
Primary.Conversion.Type=standard
Primary.Conversion.Func=0.00000,0.00000;1.00000,1.00000
Primary.Conversion.Inverted=1
Primary.Conversion.MirrorFuncXY=0
Primary.Conversion.LowerDeadzone=-1.00
Primary.Conversion.UpperDeadzone=-1.00
Primary.Conversion.LowerCenterDeadzone=-1.00
Primary.Conversion.UpperCenterDeadzone=-1.00
Primary.Input.Device=[T.Flight Hotas X]
Primary.Input.InputType=hat N-S as axis
Primary.Input.InputNumber=0
[RCS Lin Z]
Primary.Conversion.Type=standard
Primary.Conversion.Func=0.00000,0.00000;1.00000,1.00000
Primary.Conversion.Inverted=0
Primary.Conversion.MirrorFuncXY=0
Primary.Conversion.LowerDeadzone=-1.00
Primary.Conversion.UpperDeadzone=-1.00
Primary.Conversion.LowerCenterDeadzone=-1.00
Primary.Conversion.UpperCenterDeadzone=-1.00
Primary.Input.Device=[]
Primary.Input.InputType=combined axis
Primary.Input.InputNumber=-1
Primary.Comb1.Input.Input.Device=[T.Flight Hotas X]
Primary.Comb1.Input.Input.InputType=button
Primary.Comb1.Input.Input.InputNumber=0
Primary.Comb1.Conversion.Conversion.Type=standard
Primary.Comb1.Conversion.Conversion.Func=0.00000,0.00000;1.00000,1.00000
Primary.Comb1.Conversion.Conversion.Inverted=0
Primary.Comb1.Conversion.Conversion.MirrorFuncXY=0
Primary.Comb1.Conversion.Conversion.LowerDeadzone=-1.00
Primary.Comb1.Conversion.Conversion.UpperDeadzone=-1.00
Primary.Comb1.Conversion.Conversion.LowerCenterDeadzone=-1.00
Primary.Comb1.Conversion.Conversion.UpperCenterDeadzone=-1.00
Primary.Comb2.Input.Input.Device=[T.Flight Hotas X]
Primary.Comb2.Input.Input.InputType=button
Primary.Comb2.Input.Input.InputNumber=1
Primary.Comb2.Conversion.Conversion.Type=standard
Primary.Comb2.Conversion.Conversion.Func=0.00000,0.00000;1.00000,1.00000
Primary.Comb2.Conversion.Conversion.Inverted=0
Primary.Comb2.Conversion.Conversion.MirrorFuncXY=0
Primary.Comb2.Conversion.Conversion.LowerDeadzone=-1.00
Primary.Comb2.Conversion.Conversion.UpperDeadzone=-1.00
Primary.Comb2.Conversion.Conversion.LowerCenterDeadzone=-1.00
Primary.Comb2.Conversion.Conversion.UpperCenterDeadzone=-1.00
[RCS Rot X]
Primary.Conversion.Type=standard
Primary.Conversion.Func=0.00000,0.00000;1.00000,1.00000
Primary.Conversion.Inverted=1
Primary.Conversion.MirrorFuncXY=0
Primary.Conversion.LowerDeadzone=-1.00
Primary.Conversion.UpperDeadzone=-1.00
Primary.Conversion.LowerCenterDeadzone=-1.00
Primary.Conversion.UpperCenterDeadzone=-1.00
Primary.Input.Device=[T.Flight Hotas X]
Primary.Input.InputType=axis
Primary.Input.InputNumber=1
[RCS Rot Y]
Primary.Conversion.Type=standard
Primary.Conversion.Func=0.00000,0.00000;1.00000,1.00000
Primary.Conversion.Inverted=0
Primary.Conversion.MirrorFuncXY=0
Primary.Conversion.LowerDeadzone=-1.00
Primary.Conversion.UpperDeadzone=-1.00
Primary.Conversion.LowerCenterDeadzone=-1.00
Primary.Conversion.UpperCenterDeadzone=-1.00
Primary.Input.Device=[T.Flight Hotas X]
Primary.Input.InputType=axis
Primary.Input.InputNumber=3
[RCS Rot Z]
Primary.Conversion.Type=standard
Primary.Conversion.Func=0.00000,0.00000;1.00000,1.00000
Primary.Conversion.Inverted=0
Primary.Conversion.MirrorFuncXY=0
Primary.Conversion.LowerDeadzone=-1.00
Primary.Conversion.UpperDeadzone=-1.00
Primary.Conversion.LowerCenterDeadzone=-1.00
Primary.Conversion.UpperCenterDeadzone=-1.00
Primary.Input.Device=[T.Flight Hotas X]
Primary.Input.InputType=axis
Primary.Input.InputNumber=0
[Retro engine]
Primary.Conversion.Type=standard
Primary.Conversion.Func=0.00000,0.00000;1.00000,1.00000
Primary.Conversion.Inverted=0
Primary.Conversion.MirrorFuncXY=0
Primary.Conversion.LowerDeadzone=-1.00
Primary.Conversion.UpperDeadzone=-1.00
Primary.Conversion.LowerCenterDeadzone=-1.00
Primary.Conversion.UpperCenterDeadzone=-1.00
Primary.Input.Device=[]
Primary.Input.InputType=none
Primary.Input.InputNumber=-1
[Rudder]
Primary.Conversion.Type=standard
Primary.Conversion.Func=0.00000,0.00000;1.00000,1.00000
Primary.Conversion.Inverted=0
Primary.Conversion.MirrorFuncXY=0
Primary.Conversion.LowerDeadzone=-1.00
Primary.Conversion.UpperDeadzone=-1.00
Primary.Conversion.LowerCenterDeadzone=-1.00
Primary.Conversion.UpperCenterDeadzone=-1.00
Primary.Input.Device=[T.Flight Hotas X]
Primary.Input.InputType=axis
Primary.Input.InputNumber=3

Rotation on all three axes (fwd/back - pitch, left/righ - roll, twist - yaw) plus linear under thumb/forefinger (hat switch, plus two fire buttons).

It's also useful to map another button to KILLROT, but this requires using Joy2Key.

 

[AssemblyLanguage]

Thanks for all of the replies.

I didn't intend to underestimate what children can do. My OP should have stressed time-to-completion. As Urwumpe said, children lack patience. I have in mind a casual, walk-up, stand-up environment and not a classroom at least at the moment.

Thanks ADSWNJ. Your RV Orientation MFD is great. Particularly the HUD. I'm using the stock space shuttle Atlantis so I look forward to your previous suggestion that you could add a CFG button for ports that are at an angle to the spacecraft's coordinates.

Regarding Kerbal, I have other interactive activities using Orbiter so it would be confusing to switch just for docking. And, I really do like Orbiter's realism.

I've tried several approaches to the LIN joystick setup. As Kamaz mentioned, Fly-by-Wire provides a lot of flexibility. Since the throttle on the Attack 3 moves up and down, I use that for up/down with lever straight back as OFF.

Thoughts on increasing the port distance for docking success?

 

[ADSWNJ]

Thanks ADSWNJ. Your RV Orientation MFD is great. Particularly the HUD. I'm using the stock space shuttle Atlantis so I look forward to your previous suggestion that you could add a CFG button for ports that are at an angle to the spacecraft's coordinates.

I'll look into that. I have the code open at the moment for other features, so I'll add that to the punch-list. (By the way - it works with the XR-5 port which is oriented similar to the Shuttle, but the XR-5 has a docking thruster mode.)