jedidia
shoemaker without legs
Oh... well, that's not confusing at all! ?
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N_Molson
Addon Developer
Macron had Putin on the phone this morning, and it seems that Putin said "it was necessary to favor the diplomatic way". What game is he playing ?
Because right now, despite some mortar skirmishes, which probably were from the pro-Russian separatist and not the regular Red Army (they would use "more serious stuff" like MLRS obviously), there's nothing like an "invasion". For now.
Because right now, despite some mortar skirmishes, which probably were from the pro-Russian separatist and not the regular Red Army (they would use "more serious stuff" like MLRS obviously), there's nothing like an "invasion". For now.
jedidia
shoemaker without legs
To be honest, if I was russian living in the ukraine, I would probably pack up as well, even if nothing had been done to me. If that thing blows, I certainly wouldn't want to be there.
jedidia
shoemaker without legs
Well, at least the soldiers get something to do... nothing worse than having to sit idle not knowing if you're going to be sent to your death the next day...
Speaking of boredom, this is how the Russian military does OPSEC:
I guess that's one way to prevent stuff like this from happening:
www.navytimes.com
I guess that's one way to prevent stuff like this from happening:
Ensign and four chiefs charged for leaking F-35 crash video
A Navy ensign, a senior chief and three chiefs have all been charged with failure to obey an order.
www.navytimes.com
Eccentrus
Geekernaut
Actually as an ethnic chinese with family still in mainland (even in the "Party"), this makes absolute sense, China will always argue for territorial integrity, especially since it contains massive minority within its fringe regions that they consider as part of their indivisible "core". So in international relations they would also argue for territorial integrity for nations with massive minority population on their fringe regions.
the One China Policy actually precludes you to support the claim that there is One China indivisible with all its territories, and if you recognize PRC that means it includes you recognizing Taiwan as part of China. Or if it's the other way around, if you recognize ROC (Republic of China currently headquartered in Taipei), it means you also recognize its claims to the whole mainland, parts of Russia (Tuvan republic or sth), and the whole country of Mongolia. Which is why you can only have formal relations with one but not with both.
steph
Well-known member
It's a bit more nuanced in the Balkans and Ukraine, although I totally get the 'old state' policy of claiming it's 'their' land, and unfortunately Ukraine does it too. Most of the time those people just want more freedom in their regional choices, regardless of who 'the state' is. And, if it gets so bad that they want a state of their own or 'the state' doesn't allow them to exist, the question that arises is why is that the state's land. I should know, I come from a country where the state basically plugged its ears and pretended a minority doesn't exist. (actually, it's more like two or several, but the second one is universally hated so nobody cares, and the others are usually too few to get noticed).
Ukraine has regions where literally ethnic russians are the majority and the Ukrainians are the 'massive minority', yet that is Ukrainian land. It goes deeper, most of the russians there were brought half a century ago under Stalin, to 'colonize' and replace the ethnic ukrainians who teleported to the arctic. That also brings the question of what 'defines' a country. Its land? Its people? Infrastructure? A mix of all of the above? One could say that ideally this could have been defused partly even by giving greater autonomy and acceptance. Partly as in Putin might have invaded anyway because in all his 'reign' there's an acute lack of diplomacy and several cases of using wars and bloodshed to 'solve' popularity issues. And that's also something you see in the Balkans. Big state goes to war against small neighbouring state because they're easy and 'different', so it makes portraying them as enemy. I might be wrong, I haven't really looked into it that much, but most of the Yugoslav war can be summed up as 'christian old-school Serbia going to town on their muslim neighbouring country'. And that might have even been due to generals and leaders with grandiose dreams that found themselves irrelevant in the 90's and felt the need to kick stuff up.
Edit: Not to say that the russians there are 'guilty' of being in Ukraine. That in itself is no fault of their own, as the 'beauty' of dictatorships is that the average Joe doesn't get to have a say. And then some of the younger ones were born and lived in Ukraine all their life. For all intents and purposes, they're locals. Now, they can either try with autonomy (good luck with that in the current situation), but the opposite would basically mean telling them to f**k off to Russia cuz they're on Ukrainian soil (and, believe me, land claims and properties of the 'dislocated' are still very much a thing in former USSR countries, even now, so there may be Ukrainians eager to reposses grandpa's land that he had before he took the train to the Urals).But that , in itself, would still amount to 'deporting' the locals, so in a way, they'd be no better than Stalin.
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Urwumpe
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It is even worse, if you look much closer to the regional maps. Most native Russians live in the bigger cities, surrounded by ethnic Ukrainians in the rural districts. Then, you have ethnic Russian families, speaking Russian, that are absolutely pro-Ukraine. And likely also Ukrainians, who are pro-Russian.
Just looking at where the people came from in the past will be no solution, it is the problem. We need a solution for the next 50 years and not one for the past 50 years. Even a decision to give away Donezk and Luhansk oblast would be OK. But only if Ukraine as whole takes that decision - not under military threat some dictator, not by some timid diplomats from far away. But, lets be realistic there: The only reason I could see, that could make Ukraine decide to give these regions away, would be Russia accepting that the remainder of Ukraine joins NATO and EU as fast as possible - because nobody really can trust Russia in fulfilling international treaties.
Just looking at where the people came from in the past will be no solution, it is the problem. We need a solution for the next 50 years and not one for the past 50 years. Even a decision to give away Donezk and Luhansk oblast would be OK. But only if Ukraine as whole takes that decision - not under military threat some dictator, not by some timid diplomats from far away. But, lets be realistic there: The only reason I could see, that could make Ukraine decide to give these regions away, would be Russia accepting that the remainder of Ukraine joins NATO and EU as fast as possible - because nobody really can trust Russia in fulfilling international treaties.
jedidia
shoemaker without legs
It's a lot more complex, really. Neither Serbia nor Bosnia (nor Croatia nor Slovenia) existed as nations at the time. It was all Jugoslavia. But by the time the war came around, Almost all Jugoslavian state functions were controlled by people that identified as Serbs, and they decided that it would be a grand idea to officially rebrand the whole of Jugoslavia as "Greater Serbia", and kick out most of what could now be considered "foreigners". Foreigners being anybody not a member of the Orthodox church, obviously. Not because they were especially religious, but because how else are you going to tell people apart if there's no nationality and everybody's language is more similar than half german dialects (Not including Slovenian - Slovenian actually has significant differences).
So, yeah, you can call them christians, you're not wrong... you could also call them fascists, that would also not be wrong (refering to the serbian ideology of the time, and anybody still holding it, not Serbs in general. Just to be clear.)
Well Russians have doused the whole meeting thing in cold water saying there are no concrete plans for anything like that at the moment and now they've claimed that five 'Ukrainian saboteurs' attempted an incursion into Russian territory and got killed in the process after the FSB border guards requested assistance from the army. Also the leader of DPR has just requested financial and military aid from Russia so there's that too.
www.theguardian.com
There's set to be an unscheduled meeting of Russia's Security Council later today as well.
Luhansk and Donetsk regions recognised as independent states by Russia – as it happened
Russian president has recognised Ukraine’s Luhansk and Donetsk regions as independent states: Zelenskiy says ‘we are not afraid’. Follow the latest updates
www.theguardian.com
N_Molson
Addon Developer
Right now it seems what Putin wants is to make the current hazardous situation last as much as possible. Not really sure what is going on given having all those vehicles and troops moving and "on alert" is certainly costing a lot to the Russian state which already wasn't that rich. And an embargo over that would mean economical death for Russia and really nasty energy prices in Europe. ?
Well maybe he'll restore communism and SSSR
Well maybe he'll restore communism and SSSR
