Falcon 1 Flight 3 Launch Thread

[n122vu]

It might have destroyed or otherwise obstructed the camera though, which would have cut all the video until the fairing separated to give another camera a view.

Possible, but if you compare the video of the webcast-version, here:

With the full version showing the collision, here:

[opinion]
It appears to me like there are several seconds missing prior to separation, suggesting to me that, as others have indicated, the launch was being webcast on a delay and the feed was cut to prevent the failed separation from being seen live until the issue could be investigated.
[/opinion]

 

[Urwumpe]

Looks like the engine was still thrusting during separation. Maybe a too early staging?

 

[simonpro]

Urwumpe, the motor had already shut down and the thrust had fallen to (almost) zero before this spike that caused the recontact.

n122vu, yes there are seconds missing. Apparently * the one that was shown online was delayed by at least 20 seconds from realtime, even though the background noise wasn't. This is how the feed was cut prior to the stage sep.

What the others are talking about is that even in the new "full" footage there is a lot of data missing. Stage sep to fairing sep is quite a long way apart (I don't know the exact number, however) and so there's obviously something missing on the tape.
I, for one, would be interested to see that. I've heard rumors of what happened, but there's nothing like seeing it for yourself

*I say "apparently" as I didn't watch the webcast "live".

 

[Urwumpe]

Urwumpe, the motor had already shut down and the thrust had fallen to (almost) zero before this spike that caused the recontact.

I don't see no special spike in the video, the movement could also be caused by a constant acceleration after the pneumatic pushers did their work.

Do you have acceleration sensor data for this?

 

[thegrogen]

Really? I could see it as a white "cloud" that billowed out of the engine a few hundreds of milliseconds after engine shutdown. Actually, it looks like there were several "pulses" just after engine shutdown.

 

[Urwumpe]

Probably not, but SpaceX does. From http://spacex.com/updates.php#Update080608

Interestly, that is the same scenario I posted a few pages earlier.

http://orbiter-forum.com/showpost.php?p=37590&postcount=265

Now, I posted this after SpaceX, but I can at least personally claim that I found it out myself, before knowing about the news release. So, SpaceX, where is the job offer? :lol:

Also I don't say something else... the thrust did not cut-off as fast as SpaceX expected after ground tests and the staging delay was too short.

 

[C3PO]

I don't see no special spike in the video, the movement could also be caused by a constant acceleration after the pneumatic pushers did their work.

I'm sure the Merlin can exert more force then the pneumatic separators, if it was still running.

I decided to look more closely at the clip, but there's only one frame with the second stage igniting.




The next frame is black. From the previous launch videos I know that the camera swings around to capture the fairing separation, so the camera did survive the 2'nd stage ignition.
There's something flailing outside during fairing sep, but the released clip is too short to see what's going on.
The craft rotates around 90° in 0.5 seconds, so there should be plenty to look at.:lol:

 

[Urwumpe]

I'm sure the Merlin can exert more force then the pneumatic separators, if it was still running.

Not running at full thrust, but by residual thrust. As long as a engine still creates propulsion it is running.

 

[spcefrk]

So does anyone know when the next launch is?

 

[DaveS]

So does anyone know when the next launch is?

No. SpaceX has yet to announce when the next launch willl be and if this launch is something to go by, we won't know until just a few hours to a day before hand.

 

[Thunder Chicken]

No. SpaceX has yet to announce when the next launch willl be and if this launch is something to go by, we won't know until just a few hours to a day before hand.

Also, Flight 4 will not be the Malaysia payload, as they had demanded to see a fully successful launch prior to their flight. They might bump up one of the other payloads or do a dummy payload test launch.

 

[Quick_Nick]

So does anyone know when the next launch is?

Somewhat.

It looks like we may have flight four on the launch pad as soon as next month.
...
We have flight four of Falcon 1 almost ready for flight and flight five right behind that.

Also, I recall Elon saying something along the lines of 'We should have Flight 4 up no later than...' I can't remember what the date was but I was thinking it was sometime in September. I can't find this statement either so I may be completely mistaken.

 

[Andy44]

Musk said it could be ready as early as September. I doubt that, as they will need to do some engineering changes as a result of this latest accident and do some testing, but who knows, they are becoming notorious for moving quickly. From what Musk says, it sounds like he's got several more Falcon 1's lining up, so I imagine they'll probably get it right sooner or later, preferably sooner.

 

[simonpro]

September 20th is the date they're aiming for at the moment. They should announce a launch date soon, only reason they didn't advance announce last time is because the military wanted to test their quick reaction launch or somethingorother.

 

[Arrowstar]

Musk said it could be ready as early as September. I doubt that, as they will need to do some engineering changes as a result of this latest accident and do some testing, but who knows, they are becoming notorious for moving quickly. From what Musk says, it sounds like he's got several more Falcon 1's lining up, so I imagine they'll probably get it right sooner or later, preferably sooner.

I'd hate to see this behavior turn into an corporate-culturally accepted version of the aforementioned 'go fever'. However, if they can do it safely, more power to them.

 

[spcefrk]

September 20th is the date they're aiming for at the moment. They should announce a launch date soon, only reason they didn't advance announce last time is because the military wanted to test their quick reaction launch or somethingorother.

So they're going to press ahead without investigation? Let's hope they at least tweak some timing to prevent a third "recontact" failure. I wish they'd at least form a board to investigate practices that let these things slip by. Otherwise they'll just find new failures as they expand their flight envelope.

 

[Andy44]

So they're going to press ahead without investigation?

Who says an investigation has to take so long?

 

[spcefrk]

Who says an investigation has to take so long?

There's two kinds of investigations I know of:

1) The kind where you look superficially at what caused the most immediate problem (i.e. what caused the last failure) and recommend changes to fix that one problem, or

2) The kind where you look deep into your engineering, manufacturing, and management practices to determine why this failure and previous failures weren't caught before a very expensive rocket failure. Someone's getting paid the big bucks for nothing if you ask me.

It's perfectly fine to go with a Type 1 investigation -- it's fast and it gives you a sense of accomplishment at stopping a known problem. But it ignores the possibility that there's a deeper problem at hand that's going to plague future launches (and SpaceX is three for three when it comes to failures); except it will look like one new small problem every time. And once they get to five or six launch failures in a row, they'll look back and realize they've been chasing their tail without solving the bigger problem.

It's all fine, it's their gamble, and if they can pull off a reliable system in the end, then more power to them. They're chasing a really great golden goose, but I'm afraid their lax practices are going to kill the goose before they can catch it. At any rate, you won't catch me buying a ticket or payload space.