Question Aliens and the UN

Suzy

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One thing I've been wondering for a while, does the United Nations or any authority have plans to deal with the appearance of an alien fleet in the solar system? (Real aliens, not the UFO/conspiracy nonsense!) I know it's a very remote possibility, but surely some government has made plans just in case? (I did look around the UN site, but there is nothing.) I wonder what the procedure would be if alien spaceships were detected - would the public be told, or would the news be kept secret to avoid massive panic?
 

T.Neo

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I think, that if any aliens were to be detected, they would be detected by the US, or possibly Russia or China, because they have advanced tracking systems.
The US would probably keep the information to itself, and start readying it's nuclear weapons...

And when I mean secret, I mean secret secret.
 

Urwumpe

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The UN reaction will be simple. They will station UN troops in Israel. That is their normal reaction to events in the world.

The EU will send their leading figures to them, for probing an extension of the Eurozone and the Schengen Agreement to interstellar space. If they are shot down, another group of elderly politicians will be promoted away for negotiating with the USA about bombing together. The USA bomb and the EU does the ethic discussions for them.

The USA will bomb first and negotiate later.

The Russian reaction depends on the season. In the summer, they will wait for a good casus belli and then bomb the Aliens to the stone age... well at least attempt to. If it is winter, they will first attempt to reduce the natural gas deliveries to them. If this does not work, they try to assassinate the alien leaders.


-----Post Added-----


I think, that if any aliens were to be detected, they would be detected by the US, or possibly Russia or China, because they have advanced tracking systems.

The US tracking system is not much different or better to the European tracking network, the Europeans are actually the only people on the planet who use a 100m antenna for bistatic radar tracking, but the USA have better coverage to detect larger objects below 1000 km.
 

T.Neo

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The US tracking system is not much different or better to the European tracking network, the Europeans are actually the only people on the planet who use a 100m antenna for bistatic radar tracking, but the USA have better coverage to detect larger objects below 1000 km.

Is it possible to track, via radar, objects that are further then the Moon?
 

Urwumpe

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Is it possible to track, via radar, objects that are further then the Moon?

Yes, but not very good. also you can't get much further than the moon - the power demand of a radar increases at range^4. double the range and you need 16 times the power.

Thats why for long distance surveys, optical telescopes are better.
 

garyw

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I don't know about the UN but several Governments do have plans regarding the sort of responses to be taken if an alien arrives on Earth or if an Alien probe arrives in the solar system.

As far as I'm aware there is no globally agreed response to any detection of extraterrestrial intelligence. There are just too many other pressing issues right now.
 

Hielor

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... several Governments do have plans regarding the sort of responses to be taken if an alien arrives on Earth or if an Alien probe arrives in the solar system.
I really, really, want to see a source for this assertion.
 

Linguofreak

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One thing I've been wondering for a while, does the United Nations or any authority have plans to deal with the appearance of an alien fleet in the solar system? (Real aliens, not the UFO/conspiracy nonsense!) I know it's a very remote possibility, but surely some government has made plans just in case? (I did look around the UN site, but there is nothing.) I wonder what the procedure would be if alien spaceships were detected - would the public be told, or would the news be kept secret to avoid massive panic?

Depends who detects them, how they detect them, what the aliens do, etc.

In all likelyhood, if aliens do exist and actually manage to reach the solar system, and if the first group to spot them kept it quiet, they would soon be detected by another group, which might or might not make it public. If that group kept quiet, there would be a third, etc.

Furthermore, you assume that the UN or some government would be the first to spot the aliens, but more than likely it would be some group of astronomers or other, in which case they would likely make their findings known as soon as they were sure of what they were seeing. The government might not hear about it until it appeared as breaking news on CNN.

Even if a government was first to detect it, there would be great incentive not to keep it quiet, since giving other governments time to spot the aliens and claim discovery might lead to them getting PR that could otherwise have been yours.

If the aliens were trying to communicate they might be hard to ignore. Doubly so if they attack. In fact, if they're capable of getting here in the first place, their ships would be pretty hard to miss. If they get here in a way possible with known physics (ie, slower than light), they would have to be really clipping along (as in a good fraction of c) to get here in any reasonable amount of time. Unless they were just flying by, they'd have to shed most of that velocity in order to enter solar orbit, and all that kinetic energy would have to go somewhere. Their decelleration burn would be flat out impossible to miss.

If they get here by faster than light it's hard to say exactly how energetic their arrival would be, but assuming that FTL travel is possible it would have to conserve energy. So they'd have to make up for differences in speed, gravitational potential, etc. between the point they started out from and the point they wanted to get to (if they're jumping in from a star with a relative velocity of 100 km/s relative to the sun, they have to come up with the energy to change their velocity by 100 km/s somehow). Assuming that their FTL gizmo is less than 100% efficient, some energy is going to be wasted in the process of supplying the energy to equilize velocities. For a ship of any great size, the energy release would probably be fairly easy to see.
 

T.Neo

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One might think that it is arrogant to think that the aliens would specifically target Earth, but before travelling to our solar system, they would have observed it though teloscopes. They would see that Earth can support life, and would direct their attention to it.

For a ship of any great size, the energy release would probably be fairly easy to see.

So even with FTL, a spacecraft would still need large engines?
 

garyw

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I really, really, want to see a source for this assertion.

I'll see if I can find the paper that was put forward for first contact situations. I'm at work so you'll have to wait for a bit!
 

Hielor

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...but assuming that FTL travel is possible it would have to conserve energy...

"Assuming something that is impossible according to our current knowledge actually is possible, it has to follow the rules that we know."

:p
 

Linguofreak

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So even with FTL, a spacecraft would still need large engines?

Not knowing exactly how FTL would work (since it's most likely a pipe dream), it's hard to give a hard-and-fast answer, but the energy to match velocities between source and destination has to come from somewhere, either a burn before or after the jump, or some property of the jump itself.

So, in short, yes.

And even if large engines aren't needed for the jump itself, they'd still need some type of engine for lugging around at sublight speeds. If they plan to do any serious spacefaring, those engines would have to be pretty powerful, and thus hard to miss.
 

T.Neo

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hard to miss.

Imagine the night skies of a future Earth or some other alien world with this technology.


I guess one would have to be pretty careful not to fry planets or other vessels with the exhaust streams.
 

cjp

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Don't you people know the UN was founded by aliens?

:lol: now seriously. I wonder whether the UN rules allow extra-terrestrial nations to join the club.
 

jedidia

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I wonder whether the UN rules allow extra-terrestrial nations to join the club.

The aliens could definitaly accuse them of racism because of the HUMAN rights charta... :lol:
 

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I remember a NASA document from the early 1960's, which had been prepared for the US government. The document mentioned possible risks and included suggestions what to do in case NASA should detect alien life in space. But it was the time back in the late 1950's and very early 1960's, when space flight just started and everything still seemed likely. But things have changed. Science has changed. Technology has changed. Observations have shown us the cold dark reality of deep space and so conculsions have changed. I don't think that there are any up-to-date plans today. I think that even governmental people assume that another planet comparable to our planet, and so alien life, is more unlikely rather than likely. We would have observerd hundreds or even thousands of such planets or solar systems, including circumstances that would allow life. But we did not really until today. Cold Fact.

In case there is intelligent alien life somewhere, I'm sure that the distance is too big so that they won't ever reach us or conversely. Even traveling with the speed of light, which is and will remain a pipe dream, can be rather ridiculous within the deepness of the universe. And since physical laws and elements appear to be the same almost everywhere, I don't think that alien life would be very different to all the life on our planet. They also certainly would not be able to travel hundreds or even thousands of years, to reach something they saw a long time ago through their telescopes, while they looked into the past of the universe, just as we do day by day...
 

Ghostrider

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Well, don't know about other nations but Japan has giant robots and they're not afraid to use them. DOUBLE HAKKEN!

GRENDIZER5.jpg
 

cr1

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Haha... the word UNIVERSAL declaration of human rights doesn't help much since it's still for humans.

EDIT: 50th post!
 

T.Neo

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In case there is intelligent alien life somewhere, I'm sure that the distance is too big so that they won't ever reach us or conversely. Even traveling with the speed of light, which is and will remain a pipe dream, can be rather ridiculous within the deepness of the universe.

People used to think going over 50 mph would kill you, and thought heavier then air flight was not possible.

Today, we regularly go over 50 mph without any harm (except when we crash ;)) and people fly across the planet in huge 747s.

If I went back 500 years and spoke of this, I'd be burned at the stake.

If I came from 500 year in the future, and spoke of numerous "pipe dreams", I'd get put in a mental institution.

I wouldn't be surprised if one day FTL became possible. I wouldn't be surprised if it was proven to be impossible.
 
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