Project Universal Car for Orbiter (UCO)

[Spike Spiegel]

I've got a couple questions about this as well. (As if you haven't gotten enough already.)

First, does the vehicle's mass come into play at all? I didn't see anything like that in the sample config file you posted. I assume you could mimic mass based on top speed, braking power, and acceleration rate, but then I didn't see acceleration rate defined in there either. Implementing mass vs. engine power and torque could be a realistic way to simulate a vehicle, especially when towing another vessel, as that increases the mass moved by the engine. I realize it may be rather late into your development cycle to implement this.

Second, had you planned to implement a virtual cockpit? I think that would add to the "immersiveness" of the simulation. This may also be more advanced than you had planned, but it's just another idea.

Finally, as long as the thing doesn't fly through the air, I think it would be a major improvement over that shuttle tow vehicle add on. When I tested that it took off like a plane, and I couldn't understand how to hitch something to it.

Thanks for your hard work.

 

[DaveS]

Will they have attachment points, to be able to tow something, to allow pushback and such ?

I see a Shuttle Tow vehicle in our future.

Zerofay32

There already is one. I'm wondering if a config file from this addon can be used with the mesh to create a better version of that tow vehicle.

I wonder the same! Have a nice KSC/EDW tow vehicle nearly done. Just need something that can simulate towing operations realistically.

 

[dansteph]

Lot of question,I'll try to answer all (sorry for english, typing fast and not confident)


Attachment/towing/pushback

Based on my experience (maybe there's something new?) towing is not well supported by orbiter and lead to several bug (warp speed etc). Also it could maybe done for a specific articulated vehicle but this is out of scope of UCO wich is limited by the "universal" part. (even if it's okay motion would look wrong anyway unless I allow huge config file with all possible characteristic)

Crawler

Actually UCO support only 4 wheels, also to carry something (and as long as I'm correct) only admesh method is bug free and work well, attachment is not possible on ground and lead also to warp speed bugs. This is an orbiter limitation as it was not really designed for cars.

handle trailers

Same as above, ground physic is really limited and attach is not possible. So a specific addon (one model only with is dll) could be possible but not a universal one that must deal with several shape and type of cars.

What will be configurable:

Here a small example of actual config (still in work)
http://orbiter.dansteph.com/UCOCarAzure.cfg

Light, blinking light, wheels, acceleration/braking power, max speed, Ummu mesh (so you can see crew inside), turning radar animation (You can see one in azure's rear "wing") and 3 user animation. (door, technical bay, solar panel, only rotation anim etc)

See the config file.

To be added:
Possibility of carrying normalised cargo (1.5mx1.5mx1.5m) that can ressuply car with O2, fuel or food, as I see it you define in config one point for the first cargo point and the number of row/column your truck/rover/engine can carry of them. This would save "one point parameter" that could be complicated.

Box is not an obligation, as long as the cargo fit in the cargo shape (1.5m etc)

Acceleration/brake rate

You have max speed, engine power and brake power. With those number you can define either a supercar or a slow truck. "grip" parameter define if the cars slide a lot in turn or grip on ground.

Virtual cockpit

The maximum I can do is a mesh that would be displayed inside, not a full working virtual cockpit with instruments.
I think I'll add this above but I must make some test (zoom and FOV problem). (cockpit mesh should be one group only so the modeler must be confident with unwrap UVW texturing)


What other author can add:

Author can do brand new cars,truk,rover without one line of programation. Those vehicles can carry or not normalised cargo and be of any kind (I think even boat could work in some extent or gravitation speeder without weels, even heli if you don't care that it land ).

What would be cool is other long range vessel that could carry more cargo than DGIV (only one) but this require some programation (I'm ready to give the code for that)

Beta test

Beta test will open I think within one week. Documentation will be done last but there is already a "in cockpit" help display with all key and essential function. ("H" key in cockpit)

Cheers

Dan

 

[Oceanic]

wow Dan this look's amazing!

 

[Donamy]

It may be possible to use TetherMFD if an attachment were used.

 

[dansteph]

It may be possible to use TetherMFD if an attachment were used.

Yes but there is a huge difference beetween pulling something with addforce and have a rolling object that follow exactly a hardware connection.

Maybe someone found a solution that I don't know but connecting two vessel on ground via attachment always led to unstability and bug in Orbiter.

Cheers

Dan

 

[Dig Gil]

I've got a question about the container for cars, that in their turn are cargo for DGIV:

If on of, let's say, my vans have a cargo on it, then that van goes to the payload bay of DGIV, will the van's cargo still be there after unloading it from DGIV?

---------- Post added at 09:46 PM ---------- Previous post was at 09:44 PM ----------

There's also a concern from my part about momentum an inertia of the vehicles: are they reliable and realistic?

 

[garyw]

It may be possible to use TetherMFD if an attachment were used.

Or universal RMS, the vehicle on the end of the "tow" wouldn't have realistc towing motion but it's an option

 

[dansteph]

I've got a question about the container for cars, that in their turn are cargo for DGIV:
If on of, let's say, my vans have a cargo on it, then that van goes to the payload bay of DGIV, will the van's cargo still be there after unloading it from DGIV?

THAT'S a good question
Well, I don't know... mmhh let me brainstorming a bit...

[...]
[...] <- (brainstorming)
[...]

Well, at first I would say no. Cargo is internal to UCO code and cargo code on other vessel don't have access. At second I would say it's not *that* bad because huge cars that carry cargo are not usually carried with their content.

There's also a concern from my part about momentum an inertia of the vehicles: are de reliable and realistic?

I would say it's not that bad, there is inertia, glide, you feel the weight at acceleration and braking, you'll judge and make comment when the beta will be up. But it's far from actual cars simulation of course. There is no motion of the hull for example.
(did you saw the videos?)
http://orbiter.dansteph.com/forum/re...=20873&t=17793

cars in orbiter is just a salt on space travel, a way to not end the trip at landing, not the final purpose of Orbiter. (I would not choose it as a base for this)

As every addon (or simulation) I think there is a middle point to find.
Doing one accurate driving addon with only one car with advanced physic is not simple in orbiter (without good road or ground scenario it would be also very poor), allowing this for any user cars via a user configuration would be even more complicated. It may end with so much parameters and complexity that it would miss completely the point of "universality" and thus no addons author would add their work.

Dan

 

[Dig Gil]

This is great! I've had even bookmarked, some time ago, the videos (yes, I've watched them already) in case the concept were lost forever.

Well, at first I would say no. Cargo is internal to UCO code and cargo code on other vessel don't have access. At second I would say it's not *that* bad because huge cars that carry cargo are not usually carried with their content.
Dan

I warn you that this may be an excuse for crashing Orbiter... Also what about UMMU in that example van instead of cargo? (like recipe for disaster :stirpot

Notice:
I've updated the OrbiterWiki page about this project!
http://www.orbiterwiki.org/wiki/Universal_Cars_for_Orbiter
I hope some registered user uses what I've wrote to make something nicer.:thankyou:

 

[Donamy]

Did I notice a change in pitch for the engine sound, or am I just wishful thinking ?

 

[dansteph]

Did I notice a change in pitch for the engine sound, or am I just wishful thinking ?

Yes engine sound pitch change, either continuously if the engine is electric either with a "gear change style"* (but the gear is automatic, you don't have to manage them)

*don't know if it's clear, in 1st gear pitch increase as you accelerate then decrease suddenly to simulate the passage to 2nd gear etc.

Dan

 

[Dambuster]

Yes engine sound pitch change, either continuously if the engine is electric either with a "gear change style"* (but the gear is automatic, you don't have to manage them)

*don't know if it's clear, in 1st gear pitch increase as you accelerate then decrease suddenly to simulate the passage to 2nd gear etc.

Dan

Very clear, and sounding awesome! :speakcool:

 

[Donamy]

Can this be applied to propeller aircraft, for the increase in pitch sound rather than just getting louder, as it is in OrbiterSound.v3 ?

 

[willy88]

Would there be any way for a vessel to "spawn" a vehicle that has a sort of AI (like, say, a fuel truck)?

 

[escapetomsfate]

Will there be an SDK for people that want to make DLL cars?

That way you'd get possibly more functionality but keep the "universal" bit.

 

[tgep]

I'm working on a 6x6 troop carrier and this comes into light at just the right time

Question: Will the universal module take advantage of the nose wheel plug in to make turning your vehicle easier or will it be coded to have a default setting that relies on the main thrust speed ?

 

[DaveS]

How will UCO handle vehicles such as forklifts? If there's support for forklifts, I was thinking of doing the Hyster forklift used to move the demated SSMEs around between the OPFs and SSME Processing Facility.

Here's a nice photo of a Hyster with a Block II SSME outside OPF-3 for installation into the number 2 slot on Atlantis during mission processing for STS-104: http://www-pao.ksc.nasa.gov/kscpao/images/large/01pp0902.jpg

 

[gattispilot]

I suppose if you had an attachment point on the fork and on the engine then you could attach and lift the engine

 

[ar81]

Internal sound should be different than external, and also it may vary, depending on the position of the viewer in external view, just like with planes.

Here some ground vehicle blueprints.
http://www.bytutorial.com/folders/blueprints/bigcars.html