Humor Random Comments Thread

[MaverickSawyer]

Thank God, the Air Force leadership finally had a moment of clarity! I wonder how much money they blew figuring out an A-10 was better at CAS than the F-35?

I worked on A-10s and they are just nice jets to maintain. Very well thought-out design. They really should restart production of A-10s. Like C-130s, they hit upon a beautifully designed airframe and there is little room for improvement.

Indeed. The one area for improvement that I can see is making a compact targeting pod that would mount where the old Pave Penny pods went, which would free up a hard point.

 

[Urwumpe]

Thank God, the Air Force leadership finally had a moment of clarity! I wonder how much money they blew figuring out an A-10 was better at CAS than the F-35?

I worked on A-10s and they are just nice jets to maintain. Very well thought-out design. They really should restart production of A-10s. Like C-130s, they hit upon a beautifully designed airframe and there is little room for improvement.

Exactly. I also wish Germany would buy those. Its hard to get more bang for the money. And as former cannonfodder, I really would feel much better with some of those circling near me.

 

[Thunder Chicken]

Indeed. The one area for improvement that I can see is making a compact targeting pod that would mount where the old Pave Penny pods went, which would free up a hard point.

Indeed. One of the great things about the A-10 is that it is highly modular and technological upgrades are relatively easy to implement. Something like the F-35 Helmet Mounted Display system for the A-10 would be a killer combination - the right technology on the right aircraft IMO.

---------- Post added at 02:47 PM ---------- Previous post was at 02:07 PM ----------

:lol: Or something like this?:

Anybody remember Burt Rutan's Scaled Composites ARES? Kinda neat idea - engine intake on left, gun on right, but good luck repairing any ground fire damage.

 

[Linguofreak]

Good luck placing the GAU-8.

Here's a question I have: Could an F-14 variant have been designed with the GAU-8?

An interesting alternate history exercise:

Given the history surrounding the F-111 project and then the development of the Teen Series fighters, I don't think a world in which the F-111 ended up failing completely, and the Air Force ended up adopting the F-14 in its role, and then never developing the F-15 because the F-14 was competent (if not as good as the F-15) in an air superiority role, is at all inconceivable. The Navy ended up not developing the ground attack capabilites of the F-14 because they had other attack aircraft, but in a world where the USAF didn't get the F-111, they would probably at first have been most interested in the F-14 for ground attack. I'm not sure the A-10 would have been necessary in such a world, though it still might have been desirable on cost grounds, but then, reducing 3 types (A-10, F-111, F-15) to one (F-14) might have allowed enough fewer airframes to be built to offset the higher cost per airframe. And if that was the case, I could see an attempt being made to fit a GAU-8 into an F-14.

 

[MaverickSawyer]

Indeed. One of the great things about the A-10 is that it is highly modular and technological upgrades are relatively easy to implement. Something like the F-35 Helmet Mounted Display system for the A-10 would be a killer combination - the right technology on the right aircraft IMO.

F-35 Helmet Display System - YouTube

---------- Post added at 02:47 PM ---------- Previous post was at 02:07 PM ----------



Anybody remember Burt Rutan's Scaled Composites ARES? Kinda neat idea - engine intake on left, gun on right, but good luck repairing any ground fire damage.

Turbofan Killer Bee: Rutan ARES "Mudfighter" for U.S. Army Close Air Support - YouTube

A-10s already use HMS... They use Raytheon's Scorpion, iirc.

---------- Post added at 13:14 ---------- Previous post was at 13:13 ----------

Here's a question I have: Could an F-14 variant have been designed with the GAU-8?

An interesting alternate history exercise:

Given the history surrounding the F-111 project and then the development of the Teen Series fighters, I don't think a world in which the F-111 ended up failing completely, and the Air Force ended up adopting the F-14 in its role, and then never developing the F-15 because the F-14 was competent (if not as good as the F-15) in an air superiority role, is at all inconceivable. The Navy ended up not developing the ground attack capabilites of the F-14 because they had other attack aircraft, but in a world where the USAF didn't get the F-111, they would probably at first have been most interested in the F-14 for ground attack. I'm not sure the A-10 would have been necessary in such a world, though it still might have been desirable on cost grounds, but then, reducing 3 types (A-10, F-111, F-15) to one (F-14) might have allowed enough fewer airframes to be built to offset the higher cost per airframe. And if that was the case, I could see an attempt being made to fit a GAU-8 into an F-14.

It probably would have been pod-mounted on the underside, possibly between the engines.

 

[jedidia]

You don't like heroic stories too much. Oh, you like the romanticism of them well enough, but you know that reality doesn't work that way. And you don't like how they are used to motivate people to do all kinds of stupid things.
So of course you'd like your kid to develop a balanced worldview, and you're using heroic stories a bit sparingly. And even when you do, you mention the caveats, you explain how things don't work that way and how things were more likely to go down. Overall, you're pretty pleased with how it's going.

And then you realise that you left yourself without the necessary analogies to explain to your 4 year old what it means to put up a fight and push for all he's worth when he's sitting on the potty.
Damn, this parenting business is complicated!!

 

[Urwumpe]

Damn, this parenting business is complicated!!

What about simply saying "You'll figure it out." and take some distance? :lol:

99% of parenting is staying calm against all odds. The rest is just being there, when you are needed.

 

[Andy44]

IMO the Pentagon wasted 25 years. After the Gulf War an effort should've been made to build a follow-on to the A-10. But the fact is that even in 1991 the USAF was already talking about retiring the airframe. I've never been impressed with the USAF upper leadership's commitment to CAS and inderdiction; the USAF was built on strategic bombing theory and that's what they've always focused on, with modifications for nuclear deterrence. CAS means supporting the Army and a land campaign.

This is why the USMC has insisted on maintaining its own fixed wing combat air capability.

About Burt Rutan's neat-o design, if you want a single-engine CAS jet the closest thing I can think of is the AV-8B Harrier II, with it's pod-mounted 25mm cannon. The Harrier took some losses during Desert Storm but got the job done.

Especially in the context of combined arms, where USMC artillery units would make "artillery raids" on Iraqi positions and then quickly pack up and roll out before the inevitable counter battery fire arrived, while Harriers circling overhead watched for the muzzle flashes of Iraqi guns and then proceeded to roll in on them with cluster bombs and cannon fire.

 

[jedidia]

99% of parenting is staying calm against all odds.

Against all odds is about right. In this case, the odds are him regularly pooping his trousers and complaining about stomac akes. He doesn't get diapers anymore, he has perfect control over his release process. Except when he's sitting on the potty, then the whole system seems to go into lockdown.

 

[Longjap]

Here's a question I have: Could an F-14...

...

Yes! No need to continue further. An :hail:F-14 could do everything. I'm preeetty sure it can fly to Mars if it needs to. This baby (+ the movie) single handedly sparked all my interest for flight as a kid. Fiddling together little models in my room.

I remember I had a VHS tape in the 90's of a doc about the F-14. Replaying the part where it shoots the AIM-54 Phoenix till it broke.:lol:

How I miss the Tomcat with the jolly rodgers scheme.
How could you US Navy!?

 

[Andy44]

Actually I recall them having problems modifying Tomcats to be able to deliver air to ground stores (nicknamed the "Bomb Cats") due to aerodynamics making it hard to cleanly separate the bombs from the airframe without throwing off the aim. I assume they worked those problems out. The F-14 is a very large airplane, especially for a fighter, so it could probably handle a large payload and gun pod. I don't imagine it'd be the best platform for loitering around a ground combat zone for long periods of time, though.

 

[Linguofreak]

Actually I recall them having problems modifying Tomcats to be able to deliver air to ground stores (nicknamed the "Bomb Cats") due to aerodynamics making it hard to cleanly separate the bombs from the airframe without throwing off the aim. I assume they worked those problems out. The F-14 is a very large airplane, especially for a fighter, so it could probably handle a large payload and gun pod.

Well, I'd imagine if my alternate history scenario had played out, either a way would have been found to fit the GAU-8 into the fuselage of the Tomcat, or ground attack variants would have made do with the Vulcan. The large payload is a given as it was meant to carry full loads of Phoenixes.

I don't imagine it'd be the best platform for loitering around a ground combat zone for long periods of time, though.

Why not, in particular? Part of the reason the Tomcat was so heavy (beyond the need to carry the Phoenix) was the Navy's fuel requirements.

 

[Andy44]

Why not, in particular? Part of the reason the Tomcat was so heavy (beyond the need to carry the Phoenix) was the Navy's fuel requirements.

I would think it was optimized for higher speeds and altitudes. Just my speculation. Note the A-10's fans are big and there are no burners on it.

 

[Thunder Chicken]

IMO the Pentagon wasted 25 years. After the Gulf War an effort should've been made to build a follow-on to the A-10. But the fact is that even in 1991 the USAF was already talking about retiring the airframe. I've never been impressed with the USAF upper leadership's commitment to CAS and inderdiction; the USAF was built on strategic bombing theory and that's what they've always focused on, with modifications for nuclear deterrence. CAS means supporting the Army and a land campaign.

I was in the Air Force between the Gulf Wars. One guy I worked with basically said that his vision of the Air Force heritage was a guy sitting on a wing of a P-51 servicing a .50 caliber machine gun, getting it ready for another combat sortie, but the Air Force leadership was a bunch of bean counters really trying to run it less as a warfighting organization than as a cost efficient bomb delivery service. Think Amazon Bomb and you get the gist of what he was trying to describe.

That bomb-delivery model for the USAF was shown to be outmoded in an insurgency-type action like Vietnam, but that model kinda worked for Gulf War I against a more-or-less conventional military enemy, and the USAF went with it because they were comfortable with that. Now we're back to fighting a distributed insurgency-type operation in ISIS, meaning we need to get back into the weeds supporting ground operations.

The USAF needs to be able to support both operational models, maintain the correct mix of aircraft and operational assets for those models, and know which model is needed. They also need to embrace the idea that one of their major roles is to support Army and Marine ground forces; that they must serve those branches, not just coexist with them.

---------- Post added at 11:58 PM ---------- Previous post was at 11:37 PM ----------

Here's a question I have: Could an F-14 variant have been designed with the GAU-8?

The F-14 already had the M61 Vulcan 20mm system - getting this system and a couple hundred rounds of ammo tucked into the airframe was a challenge (as it was for most air-to-air fighters fitted with this system). The GAU-8 and a usable amount of 30mm is a much larger package. So the quick answer is no - an F-14 variant that was modified to carry a GAU-8 would not look anything like an F-14 once all the necessary design changes were made.

The F-35A (with a rather large volume airframe) carries a 25 mm Vulcan, and there is an external mount version for the B & C variants.

 

[Fabri91]

And another earthquake in central Italy, after the bad one with 300 dead in late August, a smaller one (5.1 Richter scale) a week or so ago. This one clocked in at 6.6 Richter scale this morning.

 

[Urwumpe]

DF can really behave strange...

(Instead of a staircase below, there was suddenly a block of ice, because a bit of water turned into a ice wall)

 

[Longjap]

And another earthquake in central Italy, after the bad one with 300 dead in late August, a smaller one (5.1 Richter scale) a week or so ago. This one clocked in at 6.6 Richter scale this morning.

I think you had your share of earthquakes by now.. That's sad to hear. Take care.

Why not, in particular? Part of the reason the Tomcat was so heavy (beyond the need to carry the Phoenix) was the Navy's fuel requirements.

On a more serious note, no, sadly the F-14 had to be replaced. This beauty was build for high altitude, high range air superiority especially for carrying the AIM-54 to counter the Russian threat and was never meant or designed to be a multi-role fighter or capable to carry a GAU-8. The bombing missions where reserved for the A-6 Intruder. It was heavy, large (takes a lot of space on a carrier), complex with the sweeping wings and very expensive, and expensive to upgrade.

Besides the AIM-54 Phoenix didn't live up to the expectations IIRC and had a large fail ratio. Also it was designed to carry 6 of them, but in reality they only flew with 2 max during the cold war because of the high stress on the airframe when fully loaded. When loaded with bombs you'll encounter the same problem.

You see the difference in design between a plane solely designed for air-superiority F-14 and an A-10 solely for CAS missions. Although it might look very impressive to have f-14's circling the battlefield I'd rather have the "ugly" Hog BRRRRRRRRRRRT'ing around.
Low speed capability also means better visual awareness on the battlefield. Remember the Hogs only come into play when all the SAM's and AAA's are taken out by fast movers.

Very pleased to hear the US sticks with them.

 

[Fabri91]

I think you had your share of earthquakes by now.. That's sad to hear. Take care.

By now it's become very unfunny, even though personally I'm really lucky to live in the least dangerous zone (from a seismic point of view) in Italy in the north.

 

[Quick_Nick]

BRRRRRRRT

brrt?

 

[Andy44]

Interesting video on the new Brit carrier. Sad to see they aren't going with CATOBAR. What you can see of the ship looks nice, though. Nice lines, and that light gray, almost white paint.