Independant review to be held of NASA's manned space flight plans

[Urwumpe]

What's supposed to happen next? Opening of a Lunar Hilton?

You go further, for example by using better rovers or temporary outposts, which need not to have the full equipment of the initial outpost, as you can use the infrastructure build there.

And why not a lunar hilton? In such a research base, which has overcapacity at a point, selling slots for space tourists would not be impossible.

Science is also something, which is never really done. It produces new work itself, as the answer to a question is also always the cause for a long list of new questions. And that is a good why it is not bad having a research station on the moon, even if you don't have rocks for it's initial purpose anymore.

 

[SiberianTiger]

That's cool, but I still have 2 questions.

Hielor: did NASA come up with a Lunar outpost design that implies mobility, transportability or an ability to be disassembled and reused?

Urwumpe: did NASA or any other body come up with a clear least of scientific goals and studies that are possible to do on the surface of the Moon? Or is it actually so brief that it's not a good idea to reveal it before the funds are really raised?

From my viewpoint, the Moon CAN BE used as a really good place to put industry that produces spacecrafts and rocketry (easy to launch off), PROVIDED the research reveal there are resources there that can be self-sufficiently used in the production cycle. Such a research is necessary, but the ways to do those are open to discussion.

 

[Urwumpe]

Urwumpe: did NASA or any other body come up with a clear list of scientific goals and studies that are possible to do on the surface of the Moon? Or is it actually so brief that it's not a good idea to reveal it before the funds are really raised?

Even for the unmanned missions, there was already a huge list of experiments to be done on the moon. When it was announced that manned missions are considered, this list remained - and when it was finally known, what astronauts can do in space, the list got expanded.

Just remember: There was never a scientific reason for going to the moon. The science was just an addition: If we already go there, we can also do something more useful. The disappointment was just larger when Apollo got canceled, because the real hard science just started and even more scientific missions had been planned.

There is still a long list of things around, what scientists want to do on the surface of the moon, I just don't know where to find it compiled in one publication...

 

[SiberianTiger]

It's a good moment to get down to looking into what science can be done on the Moon and by what means.

 

[Lunar_Lander]

That "Race to the Moon" back then had some saddening sacrifices coming with it. When I was little, I found the achievement of having people on the moon really one of the greatest achievements ever (Don't get me wrong, I still think this way).

However, recently I found on the Internet, that almost all US Lunar Probe programs were scheduled to be followed by more advanced probes. For instance, the Ranger Block III would have been followed by a Block IV (I think this was like the original Block III would have been, with the cameras and additional experiments), and a Block V, which would have repeated the capsule experiment from Block II on a Block IV probe.

Also, the Lunar Orbiter would had have a Block II version, carrying IR and gamma spectrometers. And finally, there were plans for a Surveyor Block II, even carrying a Sojourner style rover.
All these were not done, most probably because the money lacked, because that was needed to get the manned systems ready.

If you just want to put, say, the ALSEP packages on the moon, a Surveyor Block II or even Block III could have done that too.

It is also interesting, that the USSR did pause the landing program after Luna 9 to send a Lunar Orbiter in the shape of Luna 10 ASAP. The next landing then wasn't until Luna 13 as we know. Bernd Leitenberger's opinion is, that from Luna 15 on (in the "second-generation" Luna program), the probes were not designed as "speed shots", but rather to do some ingenious lunar research.

He also presented an interesting answer to the question, why STS/ISS are not that present in the public and why it is so hard to get proper funding for them. He formulated answers from all five US manned space programs to the question: "Why do we send men into space?"
Here are they:

For Mercury: Because we want to send a man into space before the Russians do it.
For Gemini: Because we want to beat the Russians to the moon and because we need it as a stepping-stone for Apollo.
For Apollo: Because we want to land a American on the moon before the Russians do this.
For Shuttle: Because we want to make Orbital Transport cheaper.
For ISS: Because we want to make Zero-G research.

He said that the first three answers touch people emotionally, while the last two are more matter-of-fact answers, which do not get the public's attention as much as the first three.

 

[Moonwalker]

I think that humans won't ever stay on the lunar surface anyway, not longer than about a week per mission. If at all, we'll see a few more flights with Constellation more than a half century after Apollo. But that will be it very likely (and no significant unmanned rover and probe missions either). We have to keep in mind that there is no manned launch vehicle yet, not even a lunar module. There are just artistic concepts and a little research on models but no money and nothing seriously. Compared to the Apollo days, the whole thing, Constellation, really does not only lack, it also does not create any spirit/enthusiasm. It just sucks while NASA might even extend the operation of their oldies. Almost anybody, politicans and NASA responsible as well, are simply undecided.

I also doubt that Russia, China or Europe would go to the Moon manned. At least not within another decades well into the second half of this century. My bet regarding the future goes to a significant ISS life time extension, and an ISS replacement with Soyuz and Orion supporting crews to it in the wide future. That's my imagination of manned space flight until to the 2030's at least. Anyting else, including large-scale unmanned missions to the Moon and Mars, sadly is false hope in my point view.