Project Aquarius B1 + A-II launch vehicles (5m+ diameter rocket thread)

ISProgram

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The Aquarius B1 is a two-staged launch vehicle designed to launch between 50-130 mT (metric tons/tonnes) to LEO, depending on the configuration used. This puts it squarely in the heavy/super-heavy class of launch vehicles. It is also the commercial and institutional workhorse of my fictional space agency, IPSA (International Partnered Space Agenda). The Aquarius is meant to be a realistic rocket, a lot of work was put into making sure it was feasible in real-life.



The rocket will launch from a launchpad at Cape Canaveral.

The Aquarius B1 will be based on the Velcro Rockets meta-addon, due to the "relative simplicity" of modifying .cfg files. Still teaching myself to develop addons, so I only have some limited knowledge. The overall features of the addon have already been decided, it's now only an issue of implementing them.

Any questions or comments are appreciated. :)

EDIT: Added the Verseau/A-II medium-lift launch vehicle, in the same class as the Soyuz rocket. :facepalm:
 
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Kyle

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Sounds cool! What launch pad do you have in mind at Cape Canaveral?
 

ISProgram

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Haven't decided yet, one potential launch pad I had in mind was SLC-17B, seeing how it's abandoned and has infrastructure in place for LH2/LOX and RP-1/LOX propellants (for Delta III). Having problems finding the POS though.

Another candidate is one of the LPADs by the runway...
 
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Kyle

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Haven't decided yet, one potential launch pad I had in mind was SLC-17B, seeing how it's abandoned and has infrastructure in place for LH2/LOX and RP-1/LOX propellants (for Delta III). Having problems finding the POS though.

Another candidate is one of the LPADs by the runway...

SLC-17B is a good choice. Another good choice would be LC-36A or B, which hasn't seen a launch since 2005 and the towers are already demolished.
 

ISProgram

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Well, still have to find the POS of those pads. I'm probably going to use a LPAD first and then transition to a full-fledged launchpad (infrastructure, launch mount, etc.) later. It's just easier, unfortunately.

Of course, this is intended to only be a interim solution. The alternative is making a entirely new base, but I'm not doing that yet.

---------- Post added at 09:47 PM ---------- Previous post was at 02:23 AM ----------

Test render of the Aquarius first stage (from Dropbox).

Notice that it's floating...there's a number of serious issues I'm having at the moment, but the rocket can fly. LPAD-10 is where the initial launch location will be, until I select a different pad at Cape Canaveral.

The date is the current date for the first flight of the Aquarius (Aqr-D1) which is 7/24/2025. I won't go into details, but depending on how this addon goes, there will be additional updates with "actual" mission simulations. I have a manifest and I want to use it.

I'm using Dropbox at the moment so that the full resolution image is available, but if anyone wants to recommend a different image hosting ste, I'm all ears. :)
 

N_Molson

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Notice that it's floating...there's a number of serious issues I'm having at the moment

About this one, you can of course move your mesh on the Z axis using your favorite mesh editor (or MeshWizard).

There is also the PADBIAS parameter in Velcro Rockets, which I often found helpful. Not sure if it works with a negative value though (it was designed to offset the mesh in the +Z (forward) direction, not -Z, but that is worth a try).

I'm using Dropbox at the moment so that the full resolution image is available, but if anyone wants to recommend a different image hosting ste, I'm all ears.

Imgur works well for me, simple and efficient.
 

ISProgram

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The main issue I'm having/had as that the SketchUp axes were configured differently than what Orbiter used, so that a stage that is "upright" in SKP is on its "side" in ORB.

That has been resolved. Still an issue.

The real issue is centering the rocket on (what I think is) the Z axis...

A lot of addon rockets position it inside the stage (from Dropbox). (from left to right, Aquarius B1, [ame="http://www.orbithangar.com/searchid.php?ID=5556"]Delta IV[/ame], [ame="http://www.orbithangar.com/searchid.php?ID=5974"]Firebird I[/ame], [ame="http://www.orbithangar.com/searchid.php?ID=6438"]M-II[/ame], and the [ame="http://www.orbithangar.com/searchid.php?ID=3388"]Velcro Rockets Delta II[/ame])

With the obvious exception of mine, every other rocket is more or less centered around the origin. It's the exact position of the origin that is confusing me.

Is there a particular reason the rocket(s) are centered where they are? Does the intersection point of all three axes mean something to Orbiter? This is basically what I'm trying to figure out.
 
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N_Molson

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The main issue I'm having/had as that the SketchUp axes were configured differently than what Orbiter used, so that a stage that is "upright" in SKP is on its "side" in ORB.

Same with Anim8tor or Blender AFAIK. It is specified somewhere in the Orbiter SDK documentation that "Orbiter uses a left-handed coordinates system". No idea why, but I think it comes from there. I always had to re-orient my meshes. Experience proved me it's way better to start meshing with that in mind and check early that the orientation is correct in Orbiter. And when you deal with animations, there's no choice unless you want to get quickly insane. :beathead:

With the obvious exception of mine, every other rocket is more or less centered around the origin. It's the exact position of the origin that is confusing me.

Is there a particular reason the rocket(s) are centered where they are? Does the intersection point of all three axes mean something to Orbiter? This is basically what I'm trying to figure out.

For Orbiter, the origin is (by default) the center of everything related to a vessel. Mesh(es), thrusters, Center of Mass, etc... Remember that the mesh is only a 'visual feature'. Unless you code a .dll and play with more advanced functions (note that the one that allows to shift the Center of Mass is buggy in Orbiter 2010 P1), its safe to assume that the origin of your mesh = the origin of your rocket stage in Orbiter. Usually, it is a good idea to make the origin the Center of Mass (that will look more realistic). Of course in real life the Center of Mass shifts as the rocket burns fuel, but again this is something you don't want to worry about in Orbiter 2010 P1.
 
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ISProgram

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Oh...so it's just a reference point, and nothing else?

Like (example) Orbiter looks at the origin, and if you specified the exhaust texture is 2m below that point, that's where Orbiter would put it?
 

N_Molson

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Yes, that's it. Set a thruster position to _V(0,0,-2) and it will be 2 meters behind (-Z axis) the vessel (not the mesh !) origin.

Now say that your rocket stage mesh is 20 meters long, and that you centerd it around origin in your meshing program, the nose will be at _V(0,0,10) and the aft at _V(0,0,-10). So you'll want to define the thruster exhaust in Orbiter at _V(0,0,-10) to make it look right (that's a simplification but you get the idea :yes:).

In other words, all the art is to make the invisible 'logical' part match the visible mesh part (but you are free to cheat a bit for the simulation's sake :lol:). Think to movies. What we see on the screen is an illusion of reality, not reality ;)).
 
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ISProgram

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Okay, did a rather crude test with setting the thruster positions. It worked, with only a slight issue (from Dropbox). Yeah, the stage is four-engined, which may not have been clear earlier.

I also noticed that Orbiter seemed to rotate (switching from prograde to retrograde, for example) the vessel along the origin of the mesh itself. Maybe that's why the origin in placed in the middle of a rocket...

Regardless, I will put the origin at the COG, though only for the second stage. The first stage's COG is so low (the engine alone is half the mass of the inert stage) that it's not really feasible.

A huge weight has been lifted. I was stressing over this issue for two weeks now! :lol:

---------- Post added at 03:15 AM ---------- Previous post was at 01:38 AM ----------

For those of you who might be interested, the POS of SLC-17 is -80.5661110 28.4466670, LC-36 is -80.5400000 28.4705560.

---------- Post added at 04:18 AM ---------- Previous post was at 03:15 AM ----------

The POS of the prospective launchsite is 173.4000000 0.2166670, however the actual landmass is too small to be rendered discernibly.

It's a really small island (<7 sq km). Maybe the New Orbiter Beta can render it...

---------- Post added at 08:16 AM ---------- Previous post was at 04:18 AM ----------

Okay, completed the first "real" test flight for the rocket.

First, a little mistake, the previous picture shows the second stage with different exhaust textures than the actual version will have, since it's using Velcro as its basis.

Now. The test flight was basically flawless, a normal ascent (the rocket carried about 50300 kg to LEO) followed by a deorbiting of the upper stage (which has around 3230 kg (3.23k) of propellant left in it, which is more than enough to ensure a clean deorbit and for standard residuals.

I've done these tests before, but never in the logistical integrated form; the only thing missing is the rocket's mesh (I used a placeholder).

So now, all I have to do at the moment (in a nutshell) is:

1) Confirm LEO payload of Aquarius Heavy (without/with propellant cross-feed) and other variants
2) Integrate Meshes with model
3) Continue work on other features (independent launchpad/spaceport, payload adapters/fairing, vessels)

To explain 1), the Aquarius has a number of configurations even though its main components do not vary much. AqrB1 has no strap-on solids at the moment, since it's hard for me to calculate the dry mass and fuel weight of them. The first stage (UPM-B1) doesn't have any changes either, save for the liquid rocket boosters in the Heavy configuration, in which case it has nose cones. The upper stage (ASUS-B1) comes in two variants, a four-engine one with 1160 kN of thrust and a two-engine variant with half that. The two engine gets around 45000 kg to LEO. The payload fairings come in two variants, a medium and long variant, interchangeable with any configuration. The Heavy variant can also utilize propellant cross-feed (130mT) or just fly the cores normally (108mT). I have to confirm these numbers with actual flight, haven't done them yet.

2) is obvious enough, for the test I had to use another rocket's mesh to give me something to look at. I'm going to have to replace that eventually and edit the .cfg files accordingly.

For 3), the Aquarius is meant to have a standard stage adapter with a diameter of 2.6m, but the payload adapter used to connect that to the payload itself is different for each payload. For Aquarius, I want to make that adapter interchangeable (easy enough, just treat it as a CVEL string). I'm also considering the option of additional scenario-exclusive payloads, like a manned spacecraft. Which brings me to my next question.

Do any manned spacecraft addons use Velcro?
 

decpau

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Manned spacecraft use with Velcro

I've used many of the commonly available spacecraft 3 and dll vessels with velcro rockets in Orbiter 2006. It's just a exercise in trial and error in writing the scenario files correctly with velcro rockets. I assume the same would be true with 2010. I've also done some development of a stand alone rocket just to play around. PM me with your email contact and I can send you some example .scn files and discuss how I went about the development of my rocket. I too had the axis / distance for referencing payload and other problems like the float above ground issues you're experiencing but was able to solve them with animator and meshwizard.:tiphat:
 

ISProgram

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Okay, there's a bunch of different configuration for the Aquarius, and most of them are just a switch of the engine # and the fairing sizes, so here are the options AqrB1 will have.

There are two fairing sizes, the PLF-M and the PLF-L. The single-core version of the Aquarius can use either one, the triple-core version can only use PLF-L.

The second stage comes in two variants, the 4E and the 2E, for the four-engine version and the two-engine version, respectively. Either version can fly on the single or triple-core vehicles. At least, it looked that way from the beginning.

The first stage is essentially identical, save for when it incorporates nosecones for the triple-core version.

The triple-core configuration can optionally use propellant cross-feed.

Now the naming code for Aquarius is as follows: Aquarius 104 is the standard configuration (50300 kg to LEO). The "1" means it's a Block 1 Aquarius, the "0" represents the lack of any booster stages, and the "4" denotes the # of second stage engines.

I've already tested this configuration. Silverbird said it would get 50312 to orbit, and it has.

Aquarius 102 is a different story. Silverbird says 46014 to orbit, Orbiter...does not. Testing it out, the second stage was still in the middle of its burn (and with over 20,000 kg of fuel in it) before it smacked right back into the atmosphere and reentered at -45.684921 22.522995, halfway to Africa.

Aquarius 124 hasn't been tested yet (it should get 108-130mT to orbit). The simulation is doing some really wacky stuff...such as not lifting off even if all three boosters are engaged, among other things.

I know the CROSSFEED parameter allows for crossfeed, but which parameter allows for the simultaneous thrusting of three-core, Delta IV instead of Falcon Heavy?

rDOTGgS.png
 

N_Molson

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I know the CROSSFEED parameter allows for crossfeed, but which parameter allows for the simultaneous thrusting of three-core, Delta IV instead of Falcon Heavy?

PARALLELBURN
 

ISProgram

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The strap-on LRBs are strangely distorted and the thing won't take off at all...until they jettison, at which point it flys like a single-core.

In other news, I'm going to start inserting more realistic functions into the rocket, like delayed ignition sequences and throttling...

---------- Post added at 11:31 PM ---------- Previous post was at 11:14 PM ----------

Aquarius 104 flight profile is unaffected by "realistic" 10 second delay (to simulate engine pre-start sequence) between stage sep and ignition. Got into orbit with around 2,830 kg of fuel left.

Going to test the payload limit of AqrB1 104 beyond the confirmed 50300 kg.

---------- Post added at 11:37 PM ---------- Previous post was at 11:31 PM ----------

Does anyone know how to set the Velcro autopilot to a particular orbit parameter? (custom ApA, PeA, Inc)
 

N_Molson

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The strap-on LRBs are strangely distorted

Be sure to have your vectors normalized.

and the thing won't take off at all

Did you define engines for the boosters ?

Does anyone know how to set the Velcro autopilot to a particular orbit parameter? (custom ApA, PeA, Inc)

You have to play with the PITCHMULTIPLE, SCREENHEIGHT & MINPITCH parameters until you find the combination that suits you. That's the price of Velcro AP extreme flexibility.

Orbit inclination depends of the launch site coordinates and the launch azimuth, that's not specific to Velcro. You can set the launch azimuth, that's documented.
 

ISProgram

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Did you define engines for the boosters ?

If you mean by engine reference points, yes. I don't know what you mean by normalizing the vectors.

This is the issue I'm having.

ZCBKm88.png

rl5PodE.png

WVryEQf.png


---------- Post added at 06:29 AM ---------- Previous post was at 12:41 AM ----------

Okay, attempts to demonstrate the payload for the Aquarius 124 have so far failed; modifying the .cfg files of some default rockets in the Velcro package have so far failed (Zenit with strap-ons) because of anomalous results.

For the Zenit, these results manifested in the core and boosters (and the payload fairings) jettisoned with around 70,400 kg of fuel still in the core. The core wouldn't respond to my attempts to ignite the engines. Jettisoning it not only doesn't ignite the second stage, but results in the core suddenly reigniting and flying through the now separate upper stage.

Th upper stage burns up in the atmosphere because it doesn't have enough thrust to get high enough. Autopilot also starts acting strange...

I have no idea what's going on...:confused:

---------- Post added 01-08-15 at 03:36 AM ---------- Previous post was 01-07-15 at 06:29 AM ----------

Okay, while I'm *trying* to figure out how to get the triple-core version to actually work, I decided to go back to work on the Aquarius 104. I'm trying to implement more "realism", and eventually, integrate the test meshes in, and hopefully have some test video to display.

Just two questions...

1) What value is the THROTTLEBACK parameter set for? I'm aiming to have the vehicle maintain 4.6 Gs during ascent (same as the Atlas V). EDIT: Found out that it's in m/s. Thus, the parameter is 45.11059 m/s.

2) Is there a parameter for a delayed stage separation (where 1st stage engines shut down, but upper stage stays attached for a few seconds)?

---------- Post added at 07:56 AM ---------- Previous post was at 03:36 AM ----------

Got the test meshes in (finally) just to see if I could do it. They look bland, but I'm going to use these to "calibrate" the rocket, conponents before switching to the real deal. It's shorter than it should look, because the upper stage is sunk into the first stage.

At least it flies...

hMJRSp0.png


---------- Post added at 09:31 PM ---------- Previous post was at 07:56 AM ----------


Doesn't look like it, but this is a huge achievement for me. Obviously a lot more editing (especially with the fairings) to do, but the rocket's there. Second stage has a 10s firing delay; the video ends just before that happens (29s elapse between fairing jettison and second stage engine ignition).

---------- Post added 01-09-15 at 02:18 AM ---------- Previous post was 01-08-15 at 09:31 PM ----------

Corrected for most of the mesh issues, fairing/upper stage interface is more or less where it should be, as are exhaust textures. Apparently, the actual coordinates is the distance in meters between the vessels' origin point. The only issue I'm having now is repeating this for the first/second stage interface.

It doesn't seem to be working...

---------- Post added at 04:08 AM ---------- Previous post was at 02:18 AM ----------

wDYs205.png


Just found out how to display the axes. Wish I had known this a little while ago. :facepalm:

Single core version is basically complete on the logistics side (still have a little tinkering to do), triple core version is in development. Working on refining the autopilot so the two-engine variant doesn't burn up again, maybe activating it an altitude will do something...
 
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ISProgram

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Tested the Aquarius 124. There weren't any major issues, but the Velcro autopilot put it into a slightly elliptical (sub)orbital trajectory and ran out of fuel just before it would've been orbital.

dtusQxU.png


The rocket has strange...oscillations beginning at (EDIT: 124s) while it is still in first stage flight. The second stage doesn't exhibit this issue when it takes over. Nonetheless, you probably shouldn't try to 10x the launch phase. I noticed for the 104, that if you do this, the rocket starts oscillating, and if it tosses off the fairing while you're still 10x, the autopilot goes haywire and the rocket loses guidance.

This issue is benign compared to the one the 124 is having; if you don't 10x first stage flight you're fine.

Also, I should note that this is not the propellant cross-feed version. This is the operational mode where all cores burn for the same duration (a clustered first stage, if you will) with no throttling on the core stage. I don't know if you can implement automatic throttling in Velcro, but the main engine can throttle down to 70% of full thrust, so the option remains for it to be throttled, if it can be.

...can it be?

y2bFb9j.png


---------- Post added at 10:45 AM ---------- Previous post was at 10:15 AM ----------

Orbit's a little better. Autopilot deviation still an issue right now. Was wrong about the payload earlier, it was 111,000 kg instead of 108,000 kg. I'm expecting the crossfeed version to still get 130,000 kg to orbit.

It would've made orbit, need to work on the autopilot, if that's even possible.

o9g5uar.png
 
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orbitingpluto

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I don't know if you can implement automatic throttling in Velcro, but the main engine can throttle down to 70% of full thrust, so the option remains for it to be throttled, if it can be.

...can it be?[/QUOTE]

You can have throttle downs linked to acceleration limits with the THROTTLEBACK line in that stage's area of the scenario file, or you can set up dummy vessels to provide the thrust of a throttle up, like in the scenario file for the Delta IV Heavy from the EELV pack. It's a bit weird, and I don't know too much about it, but if you have more questions I'll try to answer them.
 

ISProgram

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I noticed the dummy vessels in the DHV configuration, and wondered how they were used, so thanks for the explanation. As for implementing that throttling, it would only be on the center core if I used it, and the alternative would be the much-easier-to-model "clustered first stage" or crossfeed versions, so I'm still thinking about that.

In the meanwhile, it's come to my attention that only one configuration of the rocket is really working as it should, and so I'm going to working on refining any inconsistencies while I try to figure out out to better improve this addon.

A few of the ideas I'm considering:
1) Working on the actual launch infrastructure (SLC-17, LC-36) instead of launching the rocket from LPAD10.
2) Implementing another rocket besides the Aquarius B1. There are two other rockets which were going to be included in future addons, the Aquarius B2 and the Verseau rocket (Verseau is French for Aquarius, but this rocket isn't directly related). Depending on how the work ends up, I wouldn't object to releasing them in this addon just to give more diversity and functionality.
3) Different scenarios. Current scenarios are just flights to LEO, but GTO flights are in consideration, as are scenarios to other planets. The latter would fit in nicely with what I was going to do in the future anyways.

Trying not to bite off more than I can chew right now, since I'm still having a orientation issue with the current rocket.
 
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