Flight Question Landing on the Pad at Brighton Beach

[Arvil]

Aha, I have a quicksave with a 22 × 22 km orbit and successfully landed at Pad 1.
And also found the record button in the main menu.
So, I re-ran it from the same Quicksave and recorded this.
Here's what I did in it.
Com/NavMFD, set nav1 to BB transponder, Nav 2 to Pad
During the flight, HoverMFD will fly to the coordinates to BB that is stored in the sim, when you switch to Nav 1 once it receives the transponder signal, it will then home in to the beacon. When you switch to Nav 2, Hover will then home in on that beacon. You may hear the engines adjust the flight to respond to the slight change in location.
Prograde, retro until landing spot is over Target
Roll 90° left use hover engines to align to target. In this, Prograde gave me the roll I needed so I adjusted both here.
Enable Hover mode
Set target to Brighton Beach
Set Horizontal Speed slightly below Orbital Speed (in this case, about 1600). Realize that Hover depends on gravity to make the ship go down, it can't push it down so won't work directly in orbit. It can only use the hovers to control the down.
Set mode to Hover
Set Brake Rate to 90%
Engage AP
HMFD will reduce H speed to programmed speed
When Brake Now Rate gets to 90% or a bit more, retros will activate (about 425 km)
When Nav1 position shows coordinates, AP off, change Hdg Target to NAV1, engage AP
Note that horizontal speed is decreasing and altitude is decreasing,
this is the AP working, note engine status shows retros are working.
Zoom in if you like.
When NAV 2 pos shows coordinates, switch Hdg Target to Nav2 using +/-
Gear down when voice says "Clear to Land" or before if your target is above mean radius
Don't know why but, it almost landed in the hub, then corrected to Pad 1 before touchdown,
perhaps when I switched from Nav1 to Nav2 late.
Now, let's see if I can find the recording.
Here it is, you'll copy it to your Scenarios\Playback folder and rename it from .txt to .scn, this forum only allows certain file types.
I don't know how to add subtitles, so just follow this. You might print this out or view it on another monitor or device.
I had an external MFD open to SurfaceMFD, sometimes others such as VTOL. Not sure if this playback will show that.
I also use HoverMFD when I fly from BB to visit the Apollo 11 landing site or another site, then return to BB. If it's far away, I'll use SuborbMFD to get a suborbital flight, then switch to HoverMFD on the downleg.

== Edit ==
I am replaying this and found out that scenario playbacks don't alter MFDs, you'll have to change the settings in Hover as you follow the above. It only seems to record the view out the window and ship operations. This is how the onboard recorder works, have no idea how those guys record actual screen videos and add subtitles, and not sure I want to get into that business anyway.
Hope this helps.

 

[Krishnan]

Aha, I have a quicksave with a 22 × 22 km orbit and successfully landed at Pad 1.
And also found the record button in the main menu.
So, I re-ran it from the same Quicksave and recorded this.
Here's what I did in it.
Com/NavMFD, set nav1 to BB transponder, Nav 2 to Pad
During the flight, HoverMFD will fly to the coordinates to BB that is stored in the sim, when you switch to Nav 1 once it receives the transponder signal, it will then home in to the beacon. When you switch to Nav 2, Hover will then home in on that beacon. You may hear the engines adjust the flight to respond to the slight change in location.
Prograde, retro until landing spot is over Target
Roll 90° left use hover engines to align to target. In this, Prograde gave me the roll I needed so I adjusted both here.
Enable Hover mode
Set target to Brighton Beach
Set Horizontal Speed slightly below Orbital Speed (in this case, about 1600). Realize that Hover depends on gravity to make the ship go down, it can't push it down so won't work directly in orbit. It can only use the hovers to control the down.
Set mode to Hover
Set Brake Rate to 90%
Engage AP
HMFD will reduce H speed to programmed speed
When Brake Now Rate gets to 90% or a bit more, retros will activate (about 425 km)
When Nav1 position shows coordinates, AP off, change Hdg Target to NAV1, engage AP
Note that horizontal speed is decreasing and altitude is decreasing,
this is the AP working, note engine status shows retros are working.
Zoom in if you like.
When NAV 2 pos shows coordinates, switch Hdg Target to Nav2 using +/-
Gear down when voice says "Clear to Land" or before if your target is above mean radius
Don't know why but, it almost landed in the hub, then corrected to Pad 1 before touchdown,
perhaps when I switched from Nav1 to Nav2 late.
Now, let's see if I can find the recording.
Here it is, you'll copy it to your Scenarios\Playback folder and rename it from .txt to .scn, this forum only allows certain file types.
I don't know how to add subtitles, so just follow this. You might print this out or view it on another monitor or device.
I had an external MFD open to SurfaceMFD, sometimes others such as VTOL. Not sure if this playback will show that.
I also use HoverMFD when I fly from BB to visit the Apollo 11 landing site or another site, then return to BB. If it's far away, I'll use SuborbMFD to get a suborbital flight, then switch to HoverMFD on the downleg.

== Edit ==
I am replaying this and found out that scenario playbacks don't alter MFDs, you'll have to change the settings in Hover as you follow the above. It only seems to record the view out the window and ship operations. This is how the onboard recorder works, have no idea how those guys record actual screen videos and add subtitles, and not sure I want to get into that business anyway.
Hope this helps.

hey, I tried the scenario playback but it was a scenario for me, not a playback....
Yes, this time I landed well, The problem is I don't know much of what the numbers are. Second, I dont know at what distance/altitude to activate the autopilot itself.
Do I have to do the deorbit burn, or will it handle itself?
Thanks so much

 

[Arvil]

Did you save the .scn in the Playback folder? Perhaps when it's there, Orbiter knows it's a playback. I reran it after posting it and it played back for me. It said 'playback' at the bottom. Yeah I thought the 'recorder' in the menu was a video playback, not so, it just creates a playback scenario, doesn't manipulate the MFDs. Don't know how to do videos. I don't know a lot of the numbers either, especially the graph at the top center.

You do have to deorbit, it can't do that, just retro until the little green square of your trajectory is near the base, roll left or right and use the hovers to move the square sideways to match up with the base, or you can yaw left or right and use the mains/retros. I engage AP as soon as I have my trajectory aligned where I want it. It'll slow the ship down to your H speed setting, and let the ship fly. It'll begin to let it start falling in altitude when it's ready, and begin to retro when your Brake Now rate gets up to or just over your setpoint.

I've used this MFD on the moon and on Mercury.

 

[Krishnan]

Did you save the .scn in the Playback folder? Perhaps when it's there, Orbiter knows it's a playback. I reran it after posting it and it played back for me. It said 'playback' at the bottom. Yeah I thought the 'recorder' in the menu was a video playback, not so, it just creates a playback scenario, doesn't manipulate the MFDs. Don't know how to do videos. I don't know a lot of the numbers either, especially the graph at the top center.

You do have to deorbit, it can't do that, just retro until the little green square of your trajectory is near the base, roll left or right and use the hovers to move the square sideways to match up with the base, or you can yaw left or right and use the mains/retros. I engage AP as soon as I have my trajectory aligned where I want it. It'll slow the ship down to your H speed setting, and let the ship fly. It'll begin to let it start falling in altitude when it's ready, and begin to retro when your Brake Now rate gets up to or just over your setpoint.

I've used this MFD on the moon and on Mercury.

Ohhhh, I get it now. My brake now rate is stuck at 81% for some reason, but I understand the steps now. Thanks so much! Yes, I have the scenario in the playback folder, but it isn't playing back for me.

 

[Arvil]

Not sure about the stuck rate, a glitch like so many others. Huh, it plays back for me, not sure why it doesn't play back for you. If you have other .scn files in that folder do they play back?

 

[Krishnan]

Yea

Not sure about the stuck rate, a glitch like so many others. Huh, it plays back for me, not sure why it doesn't play back for you. If you have other .scn files in that folder do they play back?

h, the other files do play back. I think I am looking at the wrong numbers here, I was looking at brake rate, not brake now rate.

 

[Krishnan]

I was able to use Hover MFD to do a landing at brighton beach! I was kinda worried when it made the XR2 hold altitude over the pad instead of landing there, so I adjusted the altitude to 0k.

 

[Owenmck]

I was able to use Hover MFD to do a landing at brighton beach! I was kinda worried when it made the XR2 hold altitude over the pad instead of landing there, so I adjusted the altitude to 0k.

Congrats! It always feels great when you successfully execute an efficient hover landing.

 

[Arvil]

The Brake Rate on the right is the point at which you would like Hover to begin braking, the Brake Now Rate is measures ‘If I Brake now, what retro percent would I need to stop at the pad’. The retro should come on when the Brake Now Rate on the left or slightly exceeds the Brake Rate on the right. You never set the rate for 100%, always about 90 for retros, but about 60 or 65 for hover mode. that’s because full hovers can’t be used for braking, the ship needs to vector some for maintaining the vertical m/s.

 

[Arvil]

Yeah, that altitude tool may be handy if there are nearby elevations you don’t to smack into, setting it for something higher than the mountains until final, then resetting to zero.

 

[Krishnan]

Yeah, that altitude tool may be handy if there are nearby elevations you don’t to smack into, setting it for something higher than the mountains until final, then resetting to zero.

Ohhh, I am supposed to set it to 0... I thought it automatically begins to descend and land once it reaches a certain distance from the base; Until then it holds the specified altitude. Makes sense why I was wasting fuel hovering over the pad. What about target altitude? or am I confusing that with Target distance?

 

[Arvil]

So, if you’re doing a flight from, let’s say, the Apollo 11 site back to BB, set the altitude above the moon’s highest elevation, 20 km works. Hover will hold that altitude. Then as you approach from, maybe, 100 km, drop that to above local elevations, say 3 km, as you clear them, set to 0. That tells Hover to set on the ground. btw, there’s a setting, I disremember which, that says ‘Ground’ or ‘Radius’, that sets the altitude to either the meshed terrain or to the mean radius. I usually set to radius for long distance running so hover doesn’t try to follow the terrain, than switch over to ground so it knows where the LZ is. BB is well below radius, so setting to ground tells Hover to go to 0 ground elevation.

 

[Krishnan]

So, if you’re doing a flight from, let’s say, the Apollo 11 site back to BB, set the altitude above the moon’s highest elevation, 20 km works. Hover will hold that altitude. Then as you approach from, maybe, 100 km, drop that to above local elevations, say 3 km, as you clear them, set to 0. That tells Hover to set on the ground. btw, there’s a setting, I disremember which, that says ‘Ground’ or ‘Radius’, that sets the altitude to either the meshed terrain or to the mean radius. I usually set to radius for long distance running so hover doesn’t try to follow the terrain, than switch over to ground so it knows where the LZ is. BB is well below radius, so setting to ground tells Hover to go to 0 ground elevation.

Ahh, makes so much sense. Thanks!!

 

[Arvil]

I also tried something interesting last night. Using the same quicksave 22x22 km orbit, I set up hover, then I set the horizon velocity a bit below orbital speed and engaged. Hover retroed to match that speed, so now I’m suborbital. Using +/- I decreased 1 km at a time until the trajectory in MapMFD was at or just beyond BB. Then I saw I would pass too much to the right, so, I disengaged AP, rolled left and used some hover engine to push my path to the left until I would pass over BB, rengaged Hover and it reoriented, and continued until a good landing. So, for fun I tried Hover to launch into 500 km orbit to rendezvous with Luna OB-1. I ended up in a high suborbit with ApA much higher. So, looks like Hover can deorbit, and I think, by playing with numbers (horizon speed, vert speed and altitude) it may be able to launch into orbit.

 

[Krishnan]

I also tried something interesting last night. Using the same quicksave 22x22 km orbit, I set up hover, then I set the horizon velocity a bit below orbital speed and engaged. Hover retroed to match that speed, so now I’m suborbital. Using +/- I decreased 1 km at a time until the trajectory in MapMFD was at or just beyond BB. Then I saw I would pass too much to the right, so, I disengaged AP, rolled left and used some hover engine to push my path to the left until I would pass over BB, rengaged Hover and it reoriented, and continued until a good landing. So, for fun I tried Hover to launch into 500 km orbit to rendezvous with Luna OB-1. I ended up in a high suborbit with ApA much higher. So, looks like Hover can deorbit, and I think, by playing with numbers (horizon speed, vert speed and altitude) it may be able to launch into orbit.

So you didn't do the deorbit burn, but used hover engines to compensate?

 

[Arvil]

I let the AP deorbit for me by decreasing the Horizontal speed slowly until the orbit ends at or just beyond BB. Even did it again in a high orbit where BB was on the side after PeA and ApA where the ship was going up. That one was weird, it got to BB straight up about 1000 km high held position until gravity started to bring it down, then engaged hovers to slow the fall, but landed perfectly. It's cool to try odd flight paths and try to see if it can land. Sometime, I'll try hot approach right from transfer orbit from earth to see if it can do that.

 

[Stebb]

Hover MFD really is very useful once you have got the hang of it, so don't give up. Yes, it does automatically land you on the pad of your choice.
Have a look at the MFD user guide which is pretty comprehensive, but if you want to see a video then search 'Hover MFD' on YouTube and you might find what you are looking for.

 

[Owenmck]

You might also be interested in this video by David Courtney, showing a fully automatic landing using Pursuit MFD