Don Piccard heads for the Mesosphere

[Lunar_Lander]

Hi @all,

just found this about two weeks ago. Don Piccard (uncle of Bertrand Piccard) prepares for his eXtreme Altitude Project XAP. The goal is to fly a mixed hot-air/helium balloon system (but no Rozieré! something completely new) to an altitude of 150,000 feet!

Until now, only two unmanned balloons reached that height (the Winzen Resarch Balloon of Oct. 1972, 50 km and the BU-60 from Japan, 2002, 53 km). And now Don is about to go higher than any manned balloon before. Maybe he'll place the final world record mark, because I think it's then unlikely that there will be a higher balloon flight.

Here's his website: www.piccard.info

It's also great that he will take up scientific instruments and that it's therefore not just a world record attempt. And here's my discussion idea: Which measurements would you take on a balloon flight into the Mesosphere? I'll post my ideas later, now it's your turn .

Cheers ,
Lunar_Lander

 

[Chipstone306]

How long do you think a balloon of that nature could remain aloft?

 

[doggie015]

How long do you think a balloon of that nature could remain aloft?

theoretically: as long as the atmosphere remains
practically: depends on quality of the balloon and size of the supplies module

 

[Chode]

One problem I see with this plan (among many): Isn't Don Piccard about 80 years old?

Regards

 

[pete.dakota]

One problem I see with this plan (among many): Isn't Don Piccard about 80 years old?

Regards

Why would that be a problem? John Glenn flew on a Shuttle Mission at the age of 77. A balloon flight would hardly be as demanding physically.

 

[Chode]

Many people flew the shuttle prior to John Glenn's mission. No one (so far) has come close to a successful manned 150,000 ft. balloon flight.

Regards

 

[Lunar_Lander]

I don't think his age is a problem. I also had the argument of John Glenn flying the Shuttle, which pete.dakota had brought forward.

Chode, you said, you see this as one of many problems. Would you like to name the other issues you see in the project, so we can discuss them here?

chipstone, doggie015 did already answer your question: He can remain aloft as long his oxygen supply, batteries and CO2 scrubbers can hold out. f he uses solar cells, he can expand the lifetime further (of cours with a big tank of LOX and several LiOH filter cartriges. The longes balloon flight until now was the flight of the Breitling Orbiter 3 around the world in 1999. They had solar power, LOX and LiOH cartiges and could remain aloft for three weeks.

The longest Stratosphere flight until now was that of Strato-Lab III which lasted 35 hours.

I even wrote to Don and he was really enthusiastic about my suggestions, and would like to stay in contact with me. Maybe I can relay your questions through to him, if you have any questions

Cheers ,
Lunar_Lander

 

[Artlav]

I even wrote to Don and he was really enthusiastic about my suggestions, and would like to stay in contact with me. Maybe I can relay your questions through to him, if you have any questions

Are you referring to the idea to take scientific instruments up, or some other suggestion you haven't mentioned?

btw, have you received the pamphlet i sent you back in January?

 

[spcefrk]

to study

I used to launch weather balloons and we measured a lot of things.

Magnetometers were pretty common for our flights, but I've seen people take up equipment to measure Ozone, Cosmic Rays, Pressure, Temperature, validations of relativity, acceleration due to gravity, etc...

 

[Lunar_Lander]

I wrote about the instruments, which he'll want to take up, and gave him my own ideas (mostly Biology instruments).

And yes, Artlav, I received the pamphlet. Thank you very much for your effort !!!! Did you receive the mail I sent you about two weeks ago?

@spacefrk, do you have some more info about your balloon ascents?

 

[Lunar_Lander]

Update

Don just told me, when I asked him what instruments he will take aloft, that he will concentrate on the balloon system. Experiment selection should be done by a group which is experienced in such things.

However he would like to have a student's experiment onboard. Maybe having a contest and the best experiment is installed on the gondola.

That would be really cool and I like the examples he wrote me (i.e. havin feathers and lead shot falling past a grid (outsinde the gondola) simultaneously and being filmed by a high-speed camera).

Do you still have ideas for experiments?

The experiments I suggested to him were the following:

a) The first is to measure the gravity at the altitude of your flight very precisely. I read, that such an experiment was planned for the Manhigh II flight, but it wasn’t taken aboard (I think, because the instrument constructed for it did not work properly on test flights).

b) The second is to look, whether there are bacteria or other micro-organisms in the atmosphere at different altitudes. For that some kind of sterile collecting device must be constructed, but I think, that this needn’t to be complicated.

c) The third is to take aloft spores and seeds on the outside of your capsule and then look afterwards how they behave when planted.

d) The fourth experiment is one I’ve read about in a description of the RE/MAX around the world flight: There something about the effects of cosmic radiation on DNA was mentioned. Maybe you could take aloft some genetic samples (such as fruit flies) and then have them examined after the flight to see if they were influenced by the mesospheric conditions.

Cheers and happy Sunday,
Lunar_Lander

 

[Chode]

Chode, you said, you see this as one of many problems. Would you like to name the other issues you see in the project, so we can discuss them here?

Cheers ,
Lunar_Lander

For a start, I would like to see the gondola put into one of the giant NASA vacuum chambers to test the overall life support systems at altitudes of 150,000 ft.

I also have concern about the landing. Balloon landings are not very predictable..

Regards.

 

[Lunar_Lander]

I see what you mean, because on Manhigh I they installed a LOX valve backwards, so that the main oxygen flow was into the Stratosphere and the bleed-off of the valve was what actually entered the cabin.

Col. Stapp therefore ordered for a altitude chamber test, before Dave Simons was allowed to procedd with the 24h Manhigh II flight, to see whether there were other flaws in the capsule which were unnoticed at that time.

So I agree with you, that the XAP's capsule should also be chamber tested.

Cheers ,
Lunar_Lander

 

[Papaloon]

Mesosphere ascension

I note that Piccard competes regularly in the Mexican road races such as La Carrera Pan Americana. Pretty wild for an octogenarian. Ballooning can't be much more demanding...

 

[Lunar_Lander]

Don's new website is online now, you can visit it here: www.mesasphere.com

 

[Ghostrider]

One problem I see with this plan (among many): Isn't Don Piccard about 80 years old?

No problem. If he's fit and willing to go, he should go. Being a pioneer doesn't have to be a young man's job.

 

[Lunar_Lander]

Quote:
Originally Posted by Chode
One problem I see with this plan (among many): Isn't Don Piccard about 80 years old?

No problem. If he's fit and willing to go, he should go. Being a pioneer doesn't have to be a young man's job.

Completely agreed !

The website also features reports and evaluations which show the feasibility of the program.

And you can find a part done by me on it too (happy guessing where it is) !

Cheers,
Lunar_Lander