Question Do we have any commercial pilots here?

captjdk

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Ark, something else to keep in mind in terms of the timing for getting your CPL is an upcomng change in the rules for charter groups hiring pilots. Sometime in the next 2 years, the rule will require 1500 hours for getting hired.

The 1500 hr requirement is for part 121 operations (scheduled air carrier operations). It wont apply for non scheds, part 135, air taxi and business operations.

Once you have your commercial ticket, working for an air taxi or part 135 operation will build your time toward the ATP minimum.

There is going to be a huge demand for pilots around the 2015 to 2025 time frame. None of the major airlines have hired in the last ten years (except a little at SWA). The pilot force is aging. Even with the change to age 65 retirement, there is going to be a huge exodus in a few years. As an example, American has more pilots over 60 than they do under 40...it's almost a 10 to 1 ratio. The average age of a Captain is 54 and the average age of a First Officer is 51 (source: APA). This info is about a year old, it might be even worse now.

Air Traffic Controllers are understaffed. All the controllers hired after Reagan fired them, are at their age 56 retirement. Many of them earn close to the pay of an airline captain.

Good mechanics, at any level (FBO, corporate, airline), are always in demand.

There are many opportunities, but, there are no cheap or easy shortcuts.

I do a lot of aviation mentoring to local groups (both military and civilian), please contact me off list and I'll be more than happy to discuss things in depth.

oops, gotta go...more later.

---------- Post added at 02:33 PM ---------- Previous post was at 01:09 PM ----------

Ok, I reread the thread...here goes.

It's never easy choosing a career path. As someone posted earlier, you have to really love airplanes. That is really important.

While currently flying for an airline, it was not my original goal (as someone else mentioned), the opportunity presented itself in the late 80's. I got my private pilot license in college at a local FBO. Went into the Air Force and flew transports. I am "between airplanes" right now, having owned individually and in partnership (including a homebuilt).

The first thing I would suggest, regardless of what career you pursue, is to get a Bachelor's degree. The DOL statistics consistently show that you will earn higher wages. That was the easy advice.

Unfortunately, you will go into debt "feeding your flying addiction".

College Aviation Programs: They are good. At first look, they seem expensive, but their structured approach will be less in the long run.

Purdue (since you list your state as Indiana), has an excellent program. Plus, they have jets that, given the opportunity, you can fly (used to fly Alumni and Faculty around).

On average, a collegiate program will cost at least 35K. That's on top of the tuition. You will emerge with a 4 year degree and Private, Commercial and CFI Ratings with Instrument and Multi-Engine endorsements. Each school will have student loan and financial aid programs.

If you already have an Associates Degree, many of your credits are transferable, so the BS degree wont be as expensive or take 4 years. The flight program is designed for a 4 year program, but having talked with some of their recruiters recently (my oldest son is making these decisions right now), they can tailor a program to your needs.

Military Training: They will pay you, but the selection process is tough. And, you will probably have to deploy to a hostile place. There is also no guarantee you will graduate from the program. I'm not too sure what the current wash out rate is.

You will receive the very best training. Thirty years ago it cost $1 Million to train an military pilot. Not sure what that cost is today, but it might be close to 2. None of the services require 20/20 vision anymore, each one has a slightly different standard. The difficulty of the selection process is dictated by how many pilots are needed.

Everyone knows of the Army (you will start in helicopters, but they have fixed wing flying also), Air Force and Navy (I include the Marine Corps in this). My youngest son wants to fly for the Coast Guard. Let's not forget about them. It's the same training. You will have the opportunity to fly both rotary wing and fixed wing. It will be very challenging, but very rewarding flying.

Being fixated on an Air Force career 30 years ago, I overlooked the Coast Guard.

Air National Guard and Reserve: Serve part time while getting a degree. This is the "back door" way to get the military to pay for your flight training. This is also the best kept secret.

Enlisting in the ANG or Reserves is a way to help pay for your degree. Go to college during the year while serving your weekend each month and some time during the summer. It wont totally pay for your school, but it will help. Use your time to get to know all the people in the unit. Let them know you're interested in a pilot slot. Each unit will have a pilot slot or two to give out each year. They usually give priority to members of their unit before some kid off the street (there's always the chance of having to take a Governor's or Senator's kid to secure funding). After college, spend 90 days going through officers school, then off to pilot training. There is also less chance of you washing out of UPT as a "guard baby", but it can happen. You can make a decent living as a "guard bum" or just fly part-time while working on other things.

Most companies do prefer hiring military trained pilots.

Ok, civilian training, other than a college program: Expensive, no way around it. But you wont have to go to war or move to exotic locations.

The usual career path is something like this: Pay for your private and commercial ticket with the instrument rating. You can start making money at that point, but it will be easier to do it if you get your CFI (instructor), which you can do along the way to your commercial ticket. Just a minute...gotta look some FAR's up.

Choosing a School: Two main ways to go, a Part 91 school and a Part 141 school. The Part 91 school is the local FBO, renting and instructing airplanes. A Part 141 will have an accelerated training program, approved by the FAA. College programs, as an example, use this program.

Either way, you must examine how often you will be flying. If you only can fly on weekends when the weather is good, then it will take more hours for each rating than the minimum than if you can also fly during the week. Flying 2 to 3 times a week is preferable. This will give you the experience base to build on the previous lesson. If it's been a week or two since your last flight, a good portion of your flight will be spent relearning some of the experience from the previous flights. While the initial price of the packaged training program is a shock, the structured program of a college or part 141 school will be less expensive in the long run

For the purposes of discussion, let's rent a Cessna at $120.00 an hour, wet, and an instructor at $50.00 an hour. This is the usual going rate ala carte. You can usually get a better deal by purchasing blocks of time in the airplane.

Bottom Line: If you go this route, do not start unless you can afford to pay for half the training when you start. Stats show that 2/3 of people who start training without the funding for 1/2 the training, never finish. It's hard enough sometimes getting the weather to cooperate (especially in winter) with your flying schedule, without having to scrounge up money too. The less you can fly, the more hours it will take and the more expensive it will be.

Private Pilot takes a minimum of 40 hrs. Lets say you can fly twice a week and do it in 55hrs, 35 hrs dual and 20 solo. You also have to factor in a ground school course (an online course or in person course) at say $200 and some ground school time with your instructor (maybe 10 hrs at $35/hr, most places charge less for ground instruction). "Sufficient instruction" is how the FAR's word it. It will be variable from one person to the next.

Private Pilot (by above estimates) $8900. (8000 to 10,000 is the average)

Commercial Pilot:

Minimum total time of 250 hours. While the 55 hours spent getting your private license does count toward the 250 hr minimum requirement, none of the time counts toward the sub totals for PIC and dual instruction (conducted under different parts of the FAR's so have to be treated differently).

Pilot in Command (PIC), 100 hrs. Taking your family flying on a nice day counts toward this total. But doesnt include the hamburgers at the airport restaurants.

Dual, 20 hrs minimum. 10 hrs of which spent on instrument training. Also several cross-country and night and prep for the test. Suppose you need 30 hours of dual.

So, 250 minus the 55 for private leaves 195 hrs you have to pay for: 30 hrs of dual and 165 of PIC. Throw in 10 hrs of ground instruction and $200 for the commercial ground school course and test...

Commercial ticket: $25,450

Now you've racked up $34,350. But at least it's been spread out over a few years!

All kidding aside, now you need to work on the instrument rating. This can be done after getting your private and while doing the dual on your commercial. Separate checkrides, separate ground schools...additional expenses. Unfortunately it adds up.

Once you get your commercial ticket, you can start making money towing banners, sightseeing tours, etc.

A CFI allows you to teach, earning $25/hr (depends on the FBO). If you are in a college program and do well, your first job could be at the school teaching undergraduates. A good way to build time while getting the minimums to move further up the food chain. Teaching at a college looks good on a resume.

Well, Ok this is getting too long....if anyone would like more info, please contact me off list.

Good Luck

Dave K
 
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