#### fred18

Donator
Hi all,

as anticipated I'm starting to build the new Multistage file, updated version of the old vinka's one.

my idea is basically to merge the vinka flexibility with the features i have developped for another project (the Jarvis DLL). In particular the launch and autopilot functionality and the failure simulations.

The project will be done in 3 steps:

1) recreating the vinka's module with all its functionalities
3) prepare a version also for the new orbiter beta

For any comments or ideas, here i am!

Cheers

Fred

Last edited:

#### boogabooga

##### Bug Crusher
Hi, fred18. Glad you are back in Orbiter.

Have you fixed all of the bugs with the Jarvis dll autopilot?

If I recall, there is still a bug in the plane change logic when you try to launch to a low inclination.

#### fred18

Donator
Hi booga,

Yep, it was only for inclinations very close to launch latitudes, I developed a preliminary solution for that, i'll apply it to this system, together with code cleaning and rewriting so there should be absolutely no foul ups and we'll have the usage of multistage automatic autopilot together with the simplicity of vinka's structure.

#### Donamy

Donator
Beta Tester
Will you have a VC view during launch ? Multistage doesn't.

#### fred18

Donator
Will you have a VC view during launch ? Multistage doesn't.

Hi Don!

I can easily implement a VC on that, but can I ask you what do you mean exactly? What would be a VC for a pure rocket?

#### K_Jameson

##### New member
For me, simplicity is the key.
We have to mantain the base logic of multistage, only with the implementation of a real autopilot and failure simulation. Moreover, "built-in" visual effects as the ones inserted in the old multistage with various tricks would be a good addition.

#### PhantomCruiser

##### Wanderer
Moderator
Tutorial Publisher
It's been a while since I've done anything w/ multistage; but is the "bug/feature" still there where when the payload separates from the rocket, that the said payload has zero fuel?

#### Lisias

##### Space Traveller Wanna-be
Hi Don!

I can easily implement a VC on that, but can I ask you what do you mean exactly? What would be a VC for a pure rocket?

Perhaps a Mission Control Center?

#### K_Jameson

##### New member
It's been a while since I've done anything w/ multistage; but is the "bug/feature" still there where when the payload separates from the rocket, that the said payload has zero fuel?

Maybe i did not understand what you mean... I've never experimented such a bug using the multistage/spacecraft duo...

#### PhantomCruiser

##### Wanderer
Moderator
Tutorial Publisher
As an example; if I load the space tug from Yuri's Energia Project onto my Energia-M, I can get it to orbit easily enough. But when I eject it as a payload the fuel tanks of the tug are empty. I can fix this via scenario editor, it's just a bit annoying.

#### fred18

Donator
For me, simplicity is the key.
We have to mantain the base logic of multistage, only with the implementation of a real autopilot and failure simulation. Moreover, "built-in" visual effects as the ones inserted in the old multistage with various tricks would be a good addition.

That is the idea: rebuild the multistage exactly as it is first, and then add new features (the main is the autoguidance). Then add effects possibilities like vent effects before launching or ullage effects at separation and make them all easy to implement within the ini file.

It's been a while since I've done anything w/ multistage; but is the "bug/feature" still there where when the payload separates from the rocket, that the said payload has zero fuel?

I rememeber that. I don't remember if it's related to multistage-spacecraft. I think it was more related to spacecraft3, like in some cases spawned sc3 vessels didn't have any fuel in them. Anyway once the job arrives to the payload part I'll check for that, if there is the fuel bug I'll correct it. :thumbup:

#### fred18

Donator
Small Poll:

Vinka's multistage applies all the thrust of the main engines to the vehicle CoG and then uses coordinates only to render exhausts. Would you rather keep this or implementing actual thruster position from ini file?

#### Face

Beta Tester
Small Poll:

Vinka's multistage applies all the thrust of the main engines to the vehicle CoG and then uses coordinates only to render exhausts. Would you rather keep this or implementing actual thruster position from ini file?

IMHO it is always best to keep the legacy behaviour as default. You could add a switch parameter to enable true position thrusting. This way old addons can be used as usual, but developers of new addons can switch it on for advanced modeling.

#### Interceptor

##### Well-known member
Hey fred18,this looks to be a great project,could you please add max Q vapor To the effects also?Thanks

#### fred18

Donator
Hey fred18,this looks to be a great project,could you please add max Q vapor To the effects also?Thanks

Sure,

actual tricks like using dummy boosters etc will remain available but the idea is also to add new possible entries in ini file like this effects

---------- Post added at 22:38 ---------- Previous post was at 15:43 ----------

Hi Guys,
for your information project is going on well... I'm able already to parse most of the ini file, to build the full stack, with correct masses, stages, engines etc.

I'm about to start to code staging, once done that only guidance system will remain to have a new multistage.

I was thinking in the meantime to the additional features asnd that's my ideas:
- as said autonomous guidance computer as in Jarvis DLL (it will be the biggest feature)
- failures (I could leave this for last I think)
- Mach 1 Vapours with simple ini calls
- possibility to have rotated payloads (actually missing and could be very useful)
- ullage effects with simple ini calls

comments or any other ideas are more than welcome!

cheers
Fred

#### boogabooga

##### Bug Crusher
You should consider leaving an option to follow the multistage2 guidance file as well, if it was provided.

Not all legacy add-ons were intending to go to low earth orbit.

#### fred18

Donator
You should consider leaving an option to follow the multistage2 guidance file as well, if it was provided.

Not all legacy add-ons were intending to go to low earth orbit.

Sure: first step of all this project is to rebuild the Vinka's module as it is in order to guarantee the full retrocompatibility, which means also old style guidance fully functional.

I want this to be used for old addons without changing anything in the config files and to be exploited with the new features for the new addons!

#### K_Jameson

##### New member
I want to update all the FOI rockets with Multistage 2015!

#### Interceptor

##### Well-known member
Hi fred18, will this also have the effect of the Rockets exhaust getting wider as it gets into thinner atmosphere effect like the Jarvis.dll does?

#### fred18

Donator
Hi fred18, will this also have the effect of the Rockets exhaust getting wider as it gets into thinner atmosphere effect like the Jarvis.dll does?

That's in my mind... actually I'm a bit worried about it: on the Jarvis it was really difficult to implement it, but I think that I can try to add a simple scheme for that for a basic initial implementation.
It will be optional by something like

Code:
[MISC]
..
GROWING_PARTICLES = 1

in the ini file.

Anyway, feature added to the wish list!