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Old 01-17-2019, 05:57 PM   #16
Donamy
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I have a SC3 vehicle, and the touchdown points don't change no matter what numbers I put in.

Code:
N = 3
POINT_1 = (-8.667,-5.0,-60) 
POINT_2 = (0 ,10 ,-60)
POINT_3 = (8.667,-5.0,-60)
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Old 01-17-2019, 06:24 PM   #17
4throck
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The syntax is simpler.
Here's something I just tested for 2001's Aries Ib


Code:
; N = number of points, 
; POINT_X = x y z stiffness damping mu mu_lng 
;see orbiter api guide for further details
N = 3
POINT_1 =  0 -10  0.57
POINT_2 = -20 10  0.57
POINT_3 =  20 10  0.57
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Old 01-17-2019, 06:36 PM   #18
fred18
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 4throck View Post
 I'm leaving the calculations up to the plugin, I have no clue what values to use.
I'm not on my computer now, but if I remember correctly the plugin prints out the values it uses in orbiter.log, so users have a reference starting point
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Old 01-17-2019, 06:37 PM   #19
Donamy
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I try this:

Code:
N = 3
POINT_1 =  0 -1.00 1.58
POINT_2 =  -1.17 -0.40 -1.59    
POINT_3 =   1.17 -0.40 -1.59
Get this no matter what.
Attached Thumbnails
TPJasonCarrier.jpg  
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Old 01-17-2019, 06:52 PM   #20
gattispilot
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Can you post the scn?
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Old 01-17-2019, 07:05 PM   #21
Donamy
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Ok, I have to completely close Orbiter, to get any changes in the attachment point. Also, getting different results from Dx7 and Dx9.
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Old 01-17-2019, 07:25 PM   #22
fred18
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Donamy View Post
 Ok, I have to completely close Orbiter, to get any changes in the attachment point. Also, getting different results from Dx7 and Dx9.
have you tried to move the vessel before checking the landend situation?

from my post yesterday:
Quote:
1) this simple plugin allows to set Touchdown points via cfg file
2) it works for specific vessel's names or for specific vessel's classes. So if for example you want to have specific touchdown points for a Deltaglider that in your scenario will be called GL01, you'll have to create the GL01.cfg inside the config/TD_Pts_Updater/ folder while if you want all the Deltagliders to have your specific touchdown points you'll have to create the Deltaglider.cfg file in the same folder
3) it won't work properly for vessels who set Touchdown points during simulations by themselves (the DG for example changes its TD points while lowering and raising the gear), but there is nothing that can be don for that.
4) you probably will not see any changes for already landed vessels until you move them either by their engines or (suggested) via scenario editor. This is because in the scenario also the arot and alt parameters and saved and used to restore the state, so if it seems to you that nothing changed, try first to move the vessels.
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Old 01-17-2019, 07:33 PM   #23
Donamy
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Yes. It is working in Dx9, but if I move the vessel in Dx7, it's like it falls off a shelf and reverts to the default attachments,
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Old 01-17-2019, 10:10 PM   #24
4throck
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Quote:
Originally Posted by fred18 View Post
 the plugin prints out the values it uses in orbiter.log, so users have a reference starting point
Yes it prints the values!

I tried some manual variations, they reduced bouncing but I was never able to get a landed state.


Here's something we can all test.
You need my
Test Satellite (Vinka's Spacecraft4)


Scenario
Code:
BEGIN_DESC

END_DESC

BEGIN_ENVIRONMENT
  System Sol
  Date MJD 53329.6270717623
  Help CurrentState_img
END_ENVIRONMENT

BEGIN_FOCUS
  Ship minisat100
END_FOCUS

BEGIN_CAMERA
  TARGET minisat100
  MODE Cockpit
  FOV 50.00
END_CAMERA

BEGIN_HUD
  TYPE Surface
END_HUD

BEGIN_MFD Left
  TYPE Orbit
  PROJ Ship
  FRAME Ecliptic
  REF Earth
END_MFD

BEGIN_MFD Right
  TYPE Surface
  SPDMODE 1
END_MFD

BEGIN_SHIPS
minisat100:spacecraft/spacecraft4
  STATUS Landed Earth
  POS -80.5906239 28.5189627
  HEADING 299.15
  ALT 0.825
  AROT 150.385 -6.591 -114.644
  AFCMODE 7
  PRPLEVEL 0:0.968004
  NAVFREQ 0 0
  CONFIGURATION 1
  CURRENT_PAYLOAD 0
END
END_SHIPS

BEGIN_TD_Pts_Updater
END

TD Points (minisat100.cfg)
Code:
N = 3
POINT_1 =  0 4 -1.2
POINT_2 =  4 -4 -1.2
POINT_3 = -4 -4 -1.2

Once it loads try to rotate the ship, just to take it off the landed state.
Then let it rest.
It remains stable, although it never reaches the landed state as it should...

Last edited by 4throck; 01-18-2019 at 12:00 AM.
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Old 01-18-2019, 03:17 AM   #25
Donamy
Beta Tester


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Quote:
Originally Posted by 4throck View Post
 Yes it prints the values!

I tried some manual variations, they reduced bouncing but I was never able to get a landed state.


Here's something we can all test.
You need my Test Satellite (Vinka's Spacecraft4)

Scenario
Code:
BEGIN_DESC

END_DESC

BEGIN_ENVIRONMENT
  System Sol
  Date MJD 53329.6270717623
  Help CurrentState_img
END_ENVIRONMENT

BEGIN_FOCUS
  Ship minisat100
END_FOCUS

BEGIN_CAMERA
  TARGET minisat100
  MODE Cockpit
  FOV 50.00
END_CAMERA

BEGIN_HUD
  TYPE Surface
END_HUD

BEGIN_MFD Left
  TYPE Orbit
  PROJ Ship
  FRAME Ecliptic
  REF Earth
END_MFD

BEGIN_MFD Right
  TYPE Surface
  SPDMODE 1
END_MFD

BEGIN_SHIPS
minisat100:spacecraft/spacecraft4
  STATUS Landed Earth
  POS -80.5906239 28.5189627
  HEADING 299.15
  ALT 0.825
  AROT 150.385 -6.591 -114.644
  AFCMODE 7
  PRPLEVEL 0:0.968004
  NAVFREQ 0 0
  CONFIGURATION 1
  CURRENT_PAYLOAD 0
END
END_SHIPS

BEGIN_TD_Pts_Updater
END
TD Points (minisat100.cfg)
Code:
N = 3
POINT_1 =  0 4 -1.2
POINT_2 =  4 -4 -1.2
POINT_3 = -4 -4 -1.2
Once it loads try to rotate the ship, just to take it off the landed state.
Then let it rest.
It remains stable, although it never reaches the landed state as it should...
In Dx9 it just sits there. In Dx7 it rolls over and bobs a little.
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Old 01-18-2019, 08:46 AM   #26
4throck
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No difference here, I get the same behavior on both graphic clients...

Some progress.
This makes the minisat settle into a landed position after a few seconds.

Code:
; N = number of points, 
; POINT_X = x y z stiffness damping mu mu_lng 
;see orbiter api guide for further details

;mass=100;
;xtx_target=-0.1;
;xtst=(-1)*(mass*9.80655)/(3*xtx_target);
;  xtst = 3269.85
;xtda=0.9*(2*sqrt(mass*xtst));
;  xtda= 1029.28684048714


N = 3
POINT_1 =  0  4 -1.2 3269 1029 1 1
POINT_2 =  4 -4 -1.2 3269 1029 1 1 
POINT_3 = -4 -4 -1.2 3269 1029 1 1
The values for mu seem to be the trick.

Last edited by 4throck; 01-18-2019 at 10:34 AM.
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Old 01-18-2019, 10:45 AM   #27
fred18
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Careful that the wind effect changes a lot the thing here, since the satellite is so light and seems that sc4 somehow define some airfoil for it.

so when it is landed it keeps being pushed from wind here and there and doesn't get to rest. I tried to turn the wind off and it stopped almost immediately.

Anyway you are surely right: the harmonic oscillator is very sensitive to changes in values, especially for such a light vessel. If you put a vessel like 20 tons there it works, but such a light vessel find very easily numerical instability.
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Old 01-18-2019, 12:24 PM   #28
4throck
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Yes.
I'm also testing with the heavy .dll landers from World of Colliers.
But I have the same issue.

They only rest after a few seconds if I manually set mu and mu_lng to zero.
This prevent landing autopilots from working, because they never get the landed state.

Any chance you can add a parameter to force a landed status ?
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Old 01-18-2019, 05:20 PM   #29
fred18
Addon Developer

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Quote:
Originally Posted by 4throck View Post
 

Yes.
I'm also testing with the heavy .dll landers from World of Colliers.
But I have the same issue.

They only rest after a few seconds if I manually set mu and mu_lng to zero.
This prevent landing autopilots from working, because they never get the landed state.
after a few seconds is ok (from my tests I found out that orbiter probably wait 5 seconds to see if a vessel is actually landed) but mu = 0 is counter intuitive. It is a friction coefficient so the higher it is the quicker the vessel should get to rest

Quote:
Originally Posted by 4throck View Post
 Any chance you can add a parameter to force a landed status ?
everything's possible but I think it would be better to better calibrate the damping and stiffness coefficients in order to let the orbiter core do his job properly.
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Old 01-18-2019, 05:55 PM   #30
Donamy
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A little OT, but a eureka moment for me. Maneuver any base to an position, rotation or height. Just attach it to this.

A BasePositioner :

Code:
[CONFIG]
MeshName ="EVAdummy"
FOCUS=1
Size = 50
Empty_Mass = 90
Fuel_Mass = 50
ATTITUDE_THRUST=5110
ISP=3200
Camera = (0,0,0)

[PARENT_ATTACH_0]
name= "object"
POS=(0.00,-2.04,-1.10)
DIR=(0,0,1)
ROT=(0,1,0)
LOOSE=0
ID=GS
RANGE=0.5 

[CHILD_ATTACH_0]	; attachment to ground
NAME="Attach"
POS=(0.0,0.0,0)
DIR=(0,1,0)
ROT=(0,0,1)
LOOSE=0
RANGE =5

[ROBOTIC_ARM]
JOINT_0_NAME="left right"
JOINT_0_SEQ=0
JOINT_0_RANGE=(0,25)
JOINT_1_NAME="forward back"
JOINT_1_SEQ=1
JOINT_1_RANGE=(0,25)
JOINT_2_NAME="up down"
JOINT_2_SEQ=2
JOINT_2_RANGE=(0,25)
JOINT_3_NAME="pitch"
JOINT_3_SEQ=3
JOINT_3_RANGE=(-360,360)
JOINT_4_NAME="yaw"
JOINT_4_SEQ=4
JOINT_4_RANGE=(-360,360)
JOINT_5_NAME="roll"
JOINT_5_SEQ=5
JOINT_5_RANGE=(-360,360)
GRAP_SEQ=0
GRAP_ATTACH=0

[ANIM_SEQ_0]	;EVA_translate, left right
INIT_POS=0.5
DURATION=100


[ANIM_SEQ_1]	;EVA_translate, forward back
INIT_POS=0.5
DURATION=150


[ANIM_SEQ_2]	;EVA_translate, up down
INIT_POS=0.5
DURATION=100

[ANIM_SEQ_3]	;EVA_pitch
INIT_POS=0.5
DURATION=100

[ANIM_SEQ_4]	;EVA_yaw
INIT_POS=0.5
DURATION=100

[ANIM_SEQ_5]	;EVA_roll
INIT_POS=0.5
DURATION=100



[ANIM_COMP_0] 	;EVA_translate, left Right
SEQ=0
GROUPS=0
RANGE(0,1)
TYPE=TRANSLATE
SHIFT=(50,0,0)



[ANIM_COMP_1] 	;EVA_translate, forward back 
SEQ=1
GROUPS=0
RANGE(0,1)
TYPE=TRANSLATE
SHIFT=(0,50,0)
PARENT=0

[ANIM_COMP_2] 	;EVA_up down
SEQ=2
GROUPS=0
RANGE(0,1)
TYPE=TRANSLATE
SHIFT=(0,0,50)
PARENT=1

[ANIM_COMP_3] 	;EVA_pitch
SEQ=3
GROUPS=1
RANGE(0,1)
TYPE=ROTATE
ROT_PNT=(0,0,0)
ROT_AXIS=(1,0,0)
ANGLE=720
PARENT=2

[ANIM_COMP_4] 	;EVA_yaw
SEQ=4
GROUPS=1
RANGE(0,1)
TYPE=ROTATE
ROT_PNT=(0,0,0)
ROT_AXIS=(0,1,0)
ANGLE=720
PARENT=3


[ANIM_COMP_5] 	;EVA_pitch
SEQ=5
GROUPS=1
RANGE(0,1)
TYPE=ROTATE
ROT_PNT=(0,0,0)
ROT_AXIS=(0,0,1)
ANGLE=720
PARENT=4


[ANIM_COMP_6]	; tip
SEQ=0
RANGE=(0,1)
TIP_1=(0.0,0.0,0.0)
TIP_2=(0.0,1.0,0.0)
TIP_3=(0.0,0.0,1.0)
PARENT=5
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