Orbiter-Forum  

Go Back   Orbiter-Forum > Orbiter Addons > Addon Development
Register Blogs Orbinauts List Social Groups FAQ Projects Mark Forums Read

Addon Development Developers post news, updates, & discussions here about your projects in development.

Reply
 
Thread Tools
Old 12-16-2016, 09:57 AM   #1
unknown_orbiter
Orbital Mystery
 
unknown_orbiter's Avatar


Default Virtual Reality

I'm strongly considering developing virtual reality (e.g. Vive, Rift, etc.) compatibility with Orbiter.

Is there anything in the works for this already, or is there interest to start such a project?
unknown_orbiter is offline   Reply With Quote
Thanked by:
Old 12-16-2016, 10:14 AM   #2
4throck
Enthusiast !
 
4throck's Avatar
Default

Is anyone really using such devices?
Reminds me a bit of "3D glasses" from a few years back.

Once you put on a VR headset, how do you see the mouse and keyboard?
Orbiter relies on those.

Don't take me wrong, playing a bit of devils advocate here
4throck is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-16-2016, 10:36 AM   #3
Urwumpe
Certain Super User
 
Urwumpe's Avatar

Default

I would love to test it, but I neither have the hardware. Its a tad bit expensive regarding my plans for 2017.

---------- Post added at 11:36 AM ---------- Previous post was at 11:35 AM ----------

Quote:
Originally Posted by 4throck View Post
 Once you put on a VR headset, how do you see the mouse and keyboard?
Orbiter relies on those.
Could be fixed by plugin.
Urwumpe is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-16-2016, 11:11 AM   #4
Artlav
Aperiodic traveller
 
Artlav's Avatar

Default

Hm, i guess i came closest to doing this so far.
OGLA engine had Oculus Rift support since before decoupling from Orbiter, and i found that it is only situationally playable.

In Spaceway, which have similar controls and physics to Orbiter, VR worked quite well when constrained by a scenario or a challenge that lets you use a simple controller.

I.e. here is one where you had to land a rocket chair that failed halfway to orbit.



All you need to control it is a USB keypad, on which you find the right keys by touch (5 have a notch).
I tried that out on a few dozen people, and most found this intuitive (only two survived the landing so far).

Anything more complex than that, and you would need to switch MFDs, look at your trajectory from outside view, interact with something, and so on, and the controls become a big problem.

One solution would be to have a virtual "HUD" plane to project mouse on, but most people still can't type blindly, and that still doesn't solve the nausea induced by free moving camera in VR (walking or looking at things from external view).

TL;DR: Adding Oculus compatibility is trivial, making it playable is a nightmare.
Artlav is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-16-2016, 01:50 PM   #5
4throck
Enthusiast !
 
4throck's Avatar
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Artlav View Post
 One solution would be to have a virtual "HUD" plane to project mouse on, but most people still can't type blindly, and that still doesn't solve the nausea induced by free moving camera in VR (walking or looking at things from external view).
That's what I guessed. Once you put a VR helmet, you are blind.
Nausea may come from lag and unrealistic FOV / depth perception, as far as I can tell.

A better approach would be a direct viewing* 3D monitor with a touch display.
Can't figure out why there aren't any.


*For a seated user finding the sweet spot for a good 3D view is not a problem. If was worse for a mobile like the Nintendo 3DS and still it worked fine.
4throck is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-16-2016, 03:24 PM   #6
unknown_orbiter
Orbital Mystery
 
unknown_orbiter's Avatar


Default

The issue with not being able to see a keyboard is easily remedied by implementing virtual windows w/ controls within the mod, such as those demonstrated in this video:


It would be relatively trivial to develop a virtual "control pad" which would provide you with all of the same controls you would use on a keyboard.

Combine this with a simple joystick and you have a fully immersed environment.

Granted, this is only practical in 3D cockpits, of which there are unfortunately few of.

But I'm definitely excited to implement this even if its simply for my own pleasure.
unknown_orbiter is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-16-2016, 07:29 PM   #7
Hielor
Defender of Truth

Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by 4throck View Post
 Is anyone really using such devices?
Reminds me a bit of "3D glasses" from a few years back.

Once you put on a VR headset, how do you see the mouse and keyboard?
Orbiter relies on those.

Don't take me wrong, playing a bit of devils advocate here
Absolutely. The HTC Vive was a complete game-changer for how I play games. 2d games just aren't as interesting anymore.

I would love to be able to play Orbiter in VR, but it would probably need a craft that had been specifically developed to have a fully-usable VC with controls large enough and spaced far enough apart for Vive wands or Touch controllers to use them.
Hielor is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-19-2016, 02:26 PM   #8
4throck
Enthusiast !
 
4throck's Avatar
Default

I see that it might be interesting for VCs, but doing them is not trivial in Orbiter.
I started some work on Gemini and it's a pain.
Even with minimal detail, all those switches make for a complex 3D model.

I guess that for an EVA VR should be fantastic, specially now with 3D terrain!
4throck is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-19-2016, 06:36 PM   #9
unknown_orbiter
Orbital Mystery
 
unknown_orbiter's Avatar


Default

I really want to implement this mod, however the lack of a virtual cockpit in the DGIV makes me not think it's worth it. I use that ship the absolute most.
unknown_orbiter is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-20-2016, 05:36 AM   #10
Donamy
Beta Tester


Default

A VR astronaut would be cool, or a VR cupola.
Donamy is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-20-2016, 12:20 PM   #11
Urwumpe
Certain Super User
 
Urwumpe's Avatar

Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Donamy View Post
 A VR astronaut would be cool, or a VR cupola.
Or a VR mars walk......
Urwumpe is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-20-2016, 04:29 PM   #12
Hlynkacg
Aspiring rocket scientist
 
Hlynkacg's Avatar


Default

Unfortunately VR using the basic Orbiter API is impossible due to the fact that orbiter does not allow you to define camera rotation axes. As such, tilting your head would break the sim.

If you did implement VR it would have to be through a dedicated graphics client that uses it's own camera control functions.
Hlynkacg is offline   Reply With Quote
Thanked by:
Old 12-20-2016, 04:31 PM   #13
Urwumpe
Certain Super User
 
Urwumpe's Avatar

Default

Or by a plugin module....
Urwumpe is offline   Reply With Quote
Thanked by:
Old 12-20-2016, 06:05 PM   #14
Hlynkacg
Aspiring rocket scientist
 
Hlynkacg's Avatar


Default

I don't think a simple plugin module would cut it. As I said above, the API as written does not allow you to define camera rotations in anything other than the local X and Y axes. I've submitted "Ability to define camera rotation matrices" as a feature request but I suspect that it's a ways down on the Professor's priority list.

Edit: I actually made a simple head tracking rig for a school project a while back and ran into this precise problem trying to get it to work with orbiter.

Last edited by Hlynkacg; 12-20-2016 at 06:10 PM.
Hlynkacg is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-20-2016, 07:53 PM   #15
Hielor
Defender of Truth

Default

Why not just rotate the entire world?
Hielor is offline   Reply With Quote
Thanked by:
Reply

  Orbiter-Forum > Orbiter Addons > Addon Development


Thread Tools

Posting Rules
BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts
Forum Jump


All times are GMT. The time now is 06:04 PM.

Quick Links Need Help?


About Us | Rules & Guidelines | TOS Policy | Privacy Policy

Orbiter-Forum is hosted at Orbithangar.com
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.6
Copyright ©2000 - 2018, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Copyright 2007 - 2017, Orbiter-Forum.com. All rights reserved.