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Old 05-15-2017, 04:42 PM   #31
Gingin
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Thanks for the advice Thorsten, I am almost there. I managed to land safely back couple of times without exceeding 5G during Alpha recovery. I should use my warthog stick instead of Keyboard, hard to do a constant Nz phase :D

I am aiming to really not to go over 4 G, and to be back on path on Entry traj 5 around 150kft.

Wolf: For the RTLS sure, I will do a separate post with Pictures and some explanations in the evening or tomorrow, when I will be happy enough with my performance.

For the Checklist why not I am gonna think to it and see how I can do something not too long.

---------- Post added at 04:42 PM ---------- Previous post was at 04:12 PM ----------

Do you know if there is a MFD like the map MFD but with Nm instead of Km?
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Old 05-15-2017, 05:27 PM   #32
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I am aiming to really not to go over 4 G, and to be back on path on Entry traj 5 around 150kft.
I'm actually not sure that's what you should be aiming at - GRTLS never goes into the late entry phase procedurally, and in reality the flight software is different. The alpha hold phase (if you have a pronounced one during RTLS) is not really similar to the late entry - you get sizeable phugoid oscillations for instance.

And yeah, keyboard sucks for pulling a constant Nz...

Quote:
Do you know if there is a MFD like the map MFD but with Nm instead of Km?
The PFD should show distance to landing site (both in MM 602 and MM 304/305) in NM if that's what you need.

@Wolf:

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A very simple checklist covering step by step procedures for OPS-1, 2 and 3 could do the job.
Manual RTLS (especially without guidance!) is pure piloting. You can outline the rough steps of what you need to do, but you can't really learn it step by step, you need to do it. The vehicle characteristics changes dramatically - initially you hardly have any excess thrust, towards the end even two good engines can deliver you nearly 3 g, and how agressively you need to steer very much depends on where and when you are. You need to develop a feel for your ride.

You can't learn that kind of thing by watching a video or reading a tutorial.

You'll get it wrong the first dozen times but eventually you'll learn.

Last edited by Thorsten; 05-15-2017 at 05:34 PM.
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Old 05-15-2017, 05:46 PM   #33
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You'll get it wrong the first dozen times but eventually you'll learn.
I can't disagree

Yep for the distance in MM304/05, problem is I don't switch to OPS 3 until MECO, until then I would like to have distance in Nm from KSC.
I converted the distance in km, so it's pretty much ok with map MFD.
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Old 05-15-2017, 07:24 PM   #34
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Gingin View Post
 Thanks for the advice Thorsten, I am almost there. I managed to land safely back couple of times without exceeding 5G during Alpha recovery. I should use my warthog stick instead of Keyboard, hard to do a constant Nz phase :D

I am aiming to really not to go over 4 G, and to be back on path on Entry traj 5 around 150kft.

Wolf: For the RTLS sure, I will do a separate post with Pictures and some explanations in the evening or tomorrow, when I will be happy enough with my performance.

For the Checklist why not I am gonna think to it and see how I can do something not too long.

---------- Post added at 04:42 PM ---------- Previous post was at 04:12 PM ----------

Do you know if there is a MFD like the map MFD but with Nm instead of Km?
Thanks a lot, some kind of tutorial would be very helpful: rerally looking forward to it.
About your question GPCMFD shows your range in NM but it is a Shuttle Fleet "custom made" MFD though OPS3 and OPS4 will work with any Orbiter ship (including SSU I believe)
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Old 05-15-2017, 07:58 PM   #35
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Ok, thanks

One very good thing to read to start understand GPC and OPS mechanic is this one:


https://www.nasa.gov/centers/johnson...face_21002.pdf

And you can complete with the full dictionnary, and you look on OPS 1, 2 or 3 for the meaning of each screen

https://www.nasa.gov/centers/johnson..._DPS_G_K_7.pdf
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Old 05-16-2017, 05:32 AM   #36
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Yep for the distance in MM304/05, problem is I don't switch to OPS 3 until MECO, until then I would like to have distance in Nm from KSC.
That... um... makes totally sense. Seems I was confused - you primarily need the distance during powered flight of course.

I'm so used to having OPS 6 software and displays available around for flying aborts that I have a hard time picturing how it would work otherwise, sorry.

I hope you'll find my comments helpful anyway - I much appreciate your spirit of taking the piloting challenge and just try. I must have done a dozen RTLS aborts under CSS to understand the basic mechanics of it (crashing the majority of them), then half a dozen to record trajectory data and then two dozen more fine-tuning the AP to get somewhere useful, and I remember the feeling of taking the challenge and just trying to fly it by the seat of your pants.

If you ever get the urge to try the procedure as outlined in the aborts workbooks (OPS 601 displays and flight software, interconnected fuel dumps, automatic MPS propellant dump after RTLS MECO, 601 guidance symbology and 'fly-to' needles on the PFD, contingency abort region determination for engine loss during RTLS, tight limit checks on qbar and Nz...) you're cordially invited to take a look over here - alas, I can't offer you anything more helpful for SSU (or Orbiter) than tips from my flight experiences.

But you seem to be doing fine
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Old 05-16-2017, 08:50 AM   #37
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I hope you'll find my comments helpful anyway
Of course
It helped a lot, I was confusing a bit with after MECO phase, your comments were helpfull.

Quote:
I much appreciate your spirit of taking the piloting challenge and just try
I am like a armchair test pilot
I like that kind of challenge. Like you I made dozen to begin to be comfortable, and I have dozen and dozen to do again ahah

Thanks for the link, I am gonna give it a very serious look
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Old 05-24-2017, 09:58 PM   #38
ItaLiaNKiinG
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This is not a tutorial, a tutorial will have every step in it.. this only has starting steps
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Old 05-24-2017, 11:22 PM   #39
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Where in this thread does it say that this is a tutorial?
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Old 05-25-2017, 08:24 AM   #40
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ItaLiaNKiinG View Post
 This is not a tutorial, a tutorial will have every step in it.. this only has starting steps
Indeed, it's not a tutorial.
But its show that we can do some really nice stuff,very realistic with SSU.
And I just covered 10% of full capability ( RMS, Rendez vous etc)
I am working on a tutorial, but it takes time, hard to sum up the essential parts of hundreds/thousands of pages
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Old 06-04-2017, 03:45 PM   #41
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Quick questions for you. When I'm trying to re-enter and go into OPS 304 after a little while the shuttle begins to roll uncontrollably. I've read somewhere that I need to use the scenario editor to empty the forward rcs tanks but I don't know which tank that is out of the 10 listed.

Did you do that to get the re-entry to work and if not can you think what I might be doing wrong here?

Appreciate the help and love those pics!

Dan
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Old 07-01-2017, 02:20 PM   #42
Gingin
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Sorry, miss your post.

Before going to OPS 304, be sure to have a 40 attitude ( more or less) and switch from OPS 303 to 304 when TFF on OPS 303 is below 4 mn.

It should work
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