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Old 09-12-2016, 12:34 AM   #16
Linguofreak
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What archive manager are you using to package the XR releases for distribution? Whatever it is, it's creating the zips with "\" as a directory separator, which causes everything to unzip into the top-level Orbiter directory for those of us running on Linux under Wine, as "\" is a valid character in Unix filenames.

This behavior is not compliant with the ZIP specification, which says the following about filenames:

Quote:
4.4.17 file name: (Variable)

4.4.17.1 The name of the file, with optional relative path.
The path stored MUST not contain a drive or
device letter, or a leading slash. All slashes
MUST be forward slashes '/' as opposed to
backwards slashes '\' for compatibility with Amiga
and UNIX file systems etc. If input came from standard
input, there is no file name field.
Could you consider using a different archive manager to package your addons? Given that this is the first time I've encountered this issue with zips created on a Windows system, I believe that most any other archive manager for Windows should create specification-conformant, portable zip files.

I will try to move everything down into the proper directories in the next few hours and verify that the XR Vessels do work under Wine, so that you don't need to go through the trouble of repackaging if they don't.
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Old 09-12-2016, 12:53 AM   #17
PeterRoss
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dbeachy1 View Post
 I have not seen that. Note that when using the keyboard, however, it takes a few seconds for the rudders to return to neutral / move to opposite lock (unlike a joystick axis, which moves them instantly). Also, your ship's velocity vector does not change the instant your nose is pointed left or right of the vector (this is all handled by the Orbiter core), so that is also part of the lag you are seeing.
The point is, while rudders are coming back to neutral position and moving further to the opposite lock, the rotation should gradually decrease, but as far as I noticed it only starts to decrease and change its direction when the opposite lock is achieved, and it happens so fast you can't stop vessel from rotating around the vertical axis until you reach the wheelstop.

Anyway, the problem may be solved by the patch you've mentioned. At least I hope so. I really love your vessels, XR fleet is my absolute favorite
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Old 09-12-2016, 01:50 AM   #18
Linguofreak
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Linguofreak View Post
 I will try to move everything down into the proper directories in the next few hours and verify that the XR Vessels do work under Wine, so that you don't need to go through the trouble of repackaging if they don't.
The XR-Series seems to work well under Wine.
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Old 09-12-2016, 04:32 AM   #19
dbeachy1
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Linguofreak View Post
 Could you consider using a different archive manager to package your addons? Given that this is the first time I've encountered this issue with zips created on a Windows system, I believe that most any other archive manager for Windows should create specification-conformant, portable zip files.
I'll look into that for the next patch release.

EDIT:
Quote:
Originally Posted by Linguofreak View Post
 I will try to move everything down into the proper directories in the next few hours and verify that the XR Vessels do work under Wine, so that you don't need to go through the trouble of repackaging if they don't.
As an easier workaround, rather than moving all those files manually you could instead extract them to a temporary folder on Windows and then re-zip up the tree using a zip package manager of your choice.

Last edited by dbeachy1; 09-12-2016 at 04:03 PM. Reason: Added note
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Old 09-12-2016, 04:54 AM   #20
JonnyBGoode
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Quote:
Originally Posted by PeterRoss View Post
 I've found quite strange behaviour with XR-2 and XR-1 vessels. If you're trying to yaw even just a little during the takeoff run, even at the very beginning of it, you're sending your XR into an insane drift, making it look like you're drifting on ice or something. XR-5 is much heavier, I guess it's why it drifts much less crazy. Nothing like this with genuine DG.
I'm wondering if this is related to the thing where if you try to hover in a craft on Earth, it starts rotating wildly and drifting off the pad.


Question for the dev team: I know you're saying this mod is updated for 2016, but it also says it is dependent on UMMU, and as far as I know, that mod is not updated for 2016. So how stable is it?
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Old 09-12-2016, 01:13 PM   #21
Abloheet
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I think ummu is disabled in this version. For example, I was unable to eva from the xr2
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Old 09-12-2016, 01:26 PM   #22
turtle91
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As far as I know, UMMU is not disabled.
You can do an EVA, but if doing this on the ground, the UMMU will be climb like a rocket into space. The reason might be, that UMMU does not (yet) take care about the new touch-down-point-logic and the new altitude-over-ground-logic.
If you still want todo EVA, you can do this in free-space.
But only use external view, BEFORE swichthing to the UMMU, otherwise the UMMU-HUD will cause Orbiter to crash.

So currently UMMU can only be used:
-in external view in space
-transfering from (i.e. docked) ship-to-ship
-UMMu can die if i.e. you de-comress the cabin in space, and (depends on your XR-config), could make the ship unflyable (no pilot=no interaction wth the ships controlls)
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Old 09-12-2016, 03:47 PM   #23
JonnyBGoode
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Will the addon still work if ummu is not installed?
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Old 09-12-2016, 03:55 PM   #24
dbeachy1
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Quote:
Originally Posted by turtle91 View Post
 As far as I know, UMMU is not disabled.
You can do an EVA, but if doing this on the ground, the UMMU will be climb like a rocket into space. The reason might be, that UMMU does not (yet) take care about the new touch-down-point-logic and the new altitude-over-ground-logic.
If you still want todo EVA, you can do this in free-space.
But only use external view, BEFORE swichthing to the UMMU, otherwise the UMMU-HUD will cause Orbiter to crash.

So currently UMMU can only be used:
-in external view in space
-transfering from (i.e. docked) ship-to-ship
-UMMu can die if i.e. you de-comress the cabin in space, and (depends on your XR-config), could make the ship unflyable (no pilot=no interaction wth the ships controlls)
turtle91 is correct; UMMu works enough for the XRs to load and show crew, but it does not work much beyond that. There's nothing we can do until if and when DanSteph updates UMMu for Orbiter 2016.

Quote:
Originally Posted by JonnyBGoode View Post
 Will the addon still work if ummu is not installed?
No. If you try to load an XR vessel without UMMu installed, you will get an error message popup and it will exit.
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Old 09-12-2016, 04:26 PM   #25
Ripley
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dbeachy1 View Post
 t...There's nothing we can do until if and when DanSteph updates UMMu for Orbiter 2016...
I'll requote myself:
http://www.orbiter-forum.com/showthr...58&postcount=3

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Old 09-13-2016, 02:41 PM   #26
PeterRoss
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One more little thing about weird behaviour:

1) If you have external cooling online but APU is off and you save and quit, when starting the scenario external cooling will turn off at startup with the appropriate voice over.

2) If you have both external cooling and APU online and save and quit, you will have both of these working on startup, but

3) If you manage to turn APU off at scenario startup before the "External cooling online" voice over the external cooling will turn off.

I guess it is connected with wheel brakes working from APU and external cooling being cut off when movement begins.
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Old 09-13-2016, 03:39 PM   #27
turtle91
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Quote:
If you have external cooling online but APU is off and you save and quit, when starting the scenario external cooling will turn off at startup with the appropriate voice over.
1)

I have this here and then, depends on the underlying terrain/pad, the ext.cooling will be off if SCN-reload. (even that APU left on and the vessel was perfectly stopped before I left the scenario).

Because of that and other reasons, I made the suggestion to couple the i.e. air-speed-button to a "switch-to-maximum-wheel-friction-function".

This could be then seen as some kind of "wheel-chocks", and I don't need to set unrealistic-friction-levels within the XR2-config, just to be able to stop the vessel at some more bumpy areas like i.e. ascension-island.


Another idea might be, like MS2015 is workarounding the ground-handling:
-at least for XR2 and XR5: we could use a payload, which will be released after parking (means if you find a place to stop your vessel...)
-then release the paylad, which should come with an attachment-controll-feature, and attach the XR2/5 to this vessel
-this "payload-vessel" could then have a very high friction-value, to hold the ships in place.
I would call it "anchor-vessel"....

But I would prefer my first idea, to make it simple.

Last edited by turtle91; 09-13-2016 at 03:46 PM.
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Old 09-13-2016, 04:17 PM   #28
Iacomus Maximus
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Quote:
Originally Posted by turtle91 View Post
 1)
This could be then seen as some kind of "wheel-chocks", and I don't need to set unrealistic-friction-levels
I like the idea of a "wheel-chocks"

They're always the first thing to set after parking an aircraft and the last thing to remove when departing.
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Old 09-14-2016, 12:01 AM   #29
dbeachy1
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Thinking about this some more, what I will do for the next patch release is make the parking brakes no longer require the APU. So you will still need the APU to apply the brakes (and therefore, to engage the parking brakes when the ship reaches wheel-stop), but once the parking brakes are set they will remain engaged without the APU.
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Old 09-14-2016, 12:40 AM   #30
turtle91
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The problem with the new parking-brake is, that in bumpy terrain (again...Ascension Island is a good test/playground), you will never reach the state(0.00 m/s) , to have a "parking-brake-can be-aplied=TRUE situation.
The only way I found to "force" the vessel to a full stop in some areas, is to use a very very high friction-setting in XR-config. But with such a high friction, you cannot do landings on a runway.(and you need cheated engines to take-off)
It's like landing with brakes full-aplied...
So we need "max-friction" instead of a "brake" (or the brake on top of the friction).

I don't know, why the standard DG has not such problems.
Friction-levels and brake-levels are looking similar to previous DG-versions....
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