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Old 01-18-2020, 11:02 PM   #16
1987VCRProductions
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For those who were asking me about using the new AMSO with Multistage 2015:



Apollo 7. So I guess I'm working on this again, stay tuned.

---------- Post added at 05:01 PM ---------- Previous post was at 05:00 PM ----------

You can, in fact, have both a LES and a fairing on a Multistage2015 vehicle. The SLA and LES tower are from Velcro Saturns.
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Old 01-18-2020, 11:16 PM   #17
4throck
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Looking forward!

I've made available a Saturn Ib that works with AMSO (https://www.orbiter-forum.com/showth...1&postcount=79 )
but I'm looking forward for a more complete addon for the Saturn family.

Can't wait
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Old 01-19-2020, 09:15 AM   #18
1987VCRProductions
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Ah, it never occurred to me to use the LES from NASSP, the one from Velcro is a tad too small. Shame that launch aborts with the tower aren't possible with MS2015, but oh well, the other abort modes that use the SPS engine work well enough. I'll work on some Saturn IB Apollo launches and then I'll work on the Saturn V.

---------- Post added at 07:16 PM ---------- Previous post was at 06:29 PM ----------

The SLA panels are giving me a headache currently. Half of them don't eject in the correct direction.



Here is my line of code for the panels:

Code:
[FAIRING]
N=4
MeshName=Velcro/Parts/SLA
Off=(0,0,-26.5)
speed=(1,1,0)
Angle=0
Diameter=6.6142
Height=17.07
Emptymass=3500
I don't know why they're off rotation by 45 degrees either, changing the angle from 0 to 45 doesn't seem to change their position either. I think I'll use your panels that you did for the Apollo Collab.

---------- Post added at 07:41 PM ---------- Previous post was at 07:16 PM ----------







New SLA panels are nice.

---------- Post added at 07:54 PM ---------- Previous post was at 07:41 PM ----------

I removed the docking probe since Apollo 7 was not a docking mission. I'll get the unmanned AS-201 and 202 missions squared away, will throw in a Skylab mission, and then crank away at the Saturn V.

---------- Post added at 08:37 PM ---------- Previous post was at 07:54 PM ----------

I noticed in the mesh folder for NASSP that there was a Little Joe model. I figured I could have some fun with that and loaded a test scenario and...well...



Oh dear. Yeah, nevermind then. I would have loaded in a LES tower as a second stage as sort of a rough way to simulate a Little Joe abort test but that's not exactly happening with this guy.

---------- Post added 01-19-20 at 03:15 AM ---------- Previous post was 01-18-20 at 08:37 PM ----------

AS-201 and AS-202 are done. Did some fiddling with the ini files and added flame trench effects and made the first stage exhaust plumes more appealing. I’ll do a Skylab mission next, this is a little trickier since I like to get the insertion parameters just right for a nominal rendezvous, I’m particular about that. I’ll also work on some Saturn V scenarios when I can.
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Old 01-19-2020, 02:18 PM   #19
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Looking good!

I think NASSP meshes are the way to go, since it's a good 2016 add-on. And you get the launch pads.

With Velcro is that people might end up with a lot of non functional scenarios and configs.
Of course you can always say on the read me "only copy textures and meshes"

Yes, those panels are a pain, that's why I made a copy. I don't think there's a problem with that, for all intents and purposes those meshes are still NASSP, not mine.


Feel free to use my Skylab B stuff (Skylab B, LEM and CM derived modules). I'll probably update scenarios for those myself, but if you want them as test cargo or something, go for it.

Last edited by 4throck; 01-19-2020 at 02:22 PM.
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Old 01-26-2020, 06:52 AM   #20
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The Saturn INT-20. I learned recently that the 5 engine variant would shut down 3 of the engines at 88 seconds, this was to prevent high g-loads late in the S-IC burn.

---------- Post added at 12:52 AM ---------- Previous post was at 12:49 AM ----------

Currently working on a separate Sol for this add-on, current name of it is Apollo_Applications_Project. I plan on incorporating the launch complexes from NASSP to add a little bit of visual flair to the add-on.
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Old 01-26-2020, 03:07 PM   #21
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Really like this addon and am using it to fly the Apollo missions that might have flown after Apollo 20 and ASTP. You should ask gattis to share some of his future Lunar equipment or advanced Skylab like using the TRS as an unman tug

---------- Post added at 03:07 PM ---------- Previous post was at 03:02 PM ----------

Nasa did look to extend Skylab some what like Skylab 1980 but using Apollo hardware to resupply since it was never planned to be done past Skylab 4 or 5. With the one solar wing missing and the tunnels not big enough to allow those racks we see in the Shuttle or ISS it was scrapped as an idea.
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Old 01-27-2020, 06:26 AM   #22
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Did lots of work today, mostly banging my head against a wall over the launch complexes. Only launch complex from NASSP I'm using thus far is LC-37, the LC-34 and 39 I'm using are Kev Shanow's models which I'm using with Spacecraft4.

Since I'm here, have some goodies.



Manned INT-20.



Apollo 7 at LC-34.



Lift-off!
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Old 01-27-2020, 10:29 AM   #23
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Looks good!

My only comment is trying to keep dependencies low.
I have nothing against Kev's pads, but if you stick with NASSP there will be less things to download
But one can always redo the scenarios to use NASSP pads... or no pads at all

So go with what you have and it will be fine
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Old 01-27-2020, 08:32 PM   #24
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I had a lot of technical issues with the NASSP pads, especially when I loaded them in as permanent meshes in the Canaveral config file. It's graphical glitches mostly, I'll have to load them in and take a screenshot to demonstrate the issues I'm having. LC-37 has this issue too but it's not as bad compared to LC-34 and 39. I would have to load them in as Spacecraft4 vessels most likely, but I had issues when I tried that with the NASSP LC-34, it refused to load into the scenario with the correct heading, it was loading in at 0 instead of 180.
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Old 01-27-2020, 09:14 PM   #25
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Having a Saturn S 1B using the AMSO CSM on the Milk Stool and with lights on for night launches would be great. I think in Skylab B 4th rock made it happen 2010. you might look to a S1B like that but the SLA panels stay on the S 1B as with the Skylab missions
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Old 01-27-2020, 10:25 PM   #26
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Quote:
Originally Posted by barrygolden View Post
 Having a Saturn S 1B using the AMSO CSM on the Milk Stool and with lights on for night launches would be great. I think in Skylab B 4th rock made it happen 2010. you might look to a S1B like that but the SLA panels stay on the S 1B as with the Skylab missions
There's a spotlight add-on I'm pretty sure where you can load in spotlights as their own vessels. I might look into that. As for having the SLA panels not jettison from the S-IVB, technically I wouldn't know how to do that. The SLA panels are loaded in as a fairing so they have to come off in some capacity.

Back to the subject of launch complexes, I loaded in the foundation of 39B from NASSP to show the issue I'm having with permanent meshes in general.



From the top it looks fine, excuse the incorrect placement of the Saturn.



But from the side there's an issue. Ideally I'd load in the mobile launcher and tower as a Spacecraft4 vessel, but in trying this I found that they load in at an angle and won't stand level with the concrete foundation of the launch complex. LC-37 has this issue where if you view the complex from above, the launch towers will appear hidden behind the ground texture, from the side 37 looks okay. I tried loading in Kev's launch complexes in this way as base meshes and have had similar issues. Not sure if it's an error in the base code (aka my fault) or if it's just due to how the meshes are constructed in the first place.

---------- Post added at 03:44 PM ---------- Previous post was at 03:40 PM ----------

For reference, here is the code for how 39B is loaded in those screenshots:

Code:
; --- Pad 39B concrete hardstand ---
MESH
	FILE ProjectApollo\CanaveralLC39A
	UNDERSHADOWS
	OWNMATERIAL
	POS -4729 22.8 3047
	ROT 89.5
    	SCALE 1
	PRELOAD
END


---------- Post added at 03:57 PM ---------- Previous post was at 03:44 PM ----------

Update, it was my fault.

UNDERSHADOWS should be SHADOW

---------- Post added at 04:03 PM ---------- Previous post was at 03:57 PM ----------

As for dependencies (apologies for taking multiple posts to get all my thoughts out) I might ask a few people if I may repackage their meshes and textures. I know that Sputnik was gracious enough to allow me to repackage a few Velcro meshes in the past. I've fully learned my lesson from the last time I tried doing an add-on on this scale.

---------- Post added at 04:25 PM ---------- Previous post was at 04:03 PM ----------

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Old 01-27-2020, 11:49 PM   #27
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For pads, have you tried using NAASP solar system on your scenarios ?

For dependencies, you can instruct the user to copy only meshes and textures from the required add-ons.
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Old 01-28-2020, 04:05 AM   #28
1987VCRProductions
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The latest stable version of NASSP (for Orbiter 2010) has the LC-39 bases loaded in as base meshes, while the mobile launcher and tower are their own spacecraft that can be rolled out to the pad. I could use the low poly meshes from the older NASSP (6.4.0) which had the launch complexes and pads as one solid thing that was a part of the base scenery, though I don't think it would look very pretty. I think it works better the way I have it now, plus the pads being their own spacecraft allows a bit of customization. Say for example, in my ideal NASA alternate history, NASA converts 39A into the Shuttle pad (as was done after the launch of Skylab) but retains 39B as a Saturn pad for Lunar, interplanetary, or Earth orbit spaceflights in general that don't necessarily require the Shuttle. There were ideas of making the Saturns into cargo launchers with a Centaur upper stage and they would be comparable in capabilities to the Titan IIIE, at least in the case of a Centaur on a Saturn IB. A Centaur on a Saturn V is a beast all its own.

---------- Post added at 10:05 PM ---------- Previous post was at 10:01 PM ----------

I'd love to get my hands on the blockhouse audio from the launch of SA-1, the first Saturn. I love it because of all the people in the blockhouse shouting GO!!

Last edited by 1987VCRProductions; 01-28-2020 at 04:03 AM.
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Old 01-28-2020, 09:40 AM   #29
4throck
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You are overthinking it

Use NASSP 2016 version with this scenario as a starting point.
You just need to add the rocket, all else is there, including floodlights.

Code:
BEGIN_DESC
NASSP base scenario
END_DESC

BEGIN_ENVIRONMENT
  System ProjectApollo\Sol_VirtualAGC
  Date MJD 40418.397222333
END_ENVIRONMENT

BEGIN_FOCUS
  Ship VAB
END_FOCUS

BEGIN_CAMERA
  TARGET VAB
  MODE Extern
  POS 2.44 0.0 -90.0
  TRACKMODE TargetRelative
  FOV 60.00
END_CAMERA

BEGIN_PANEL
END_PANEL

BEGIN_SHIPS
Crawler-Transporter:ProjectApollo\Crawler
  STATUS Landed Earth
  POS -80.6208716 28.5950241
  HEADING 65.81
  LVNAME Columbia
END
ML:ProjectApollo\ML
  STATUS Landed Earth
  POS -80.6041122 28.6083723
  HEADING 0.58
  LVNAME Columbia
END
VAB:ProjectApollo\VAB
  STATUS Landed Earth
  POS -80.6509353 28.5860469
  HEADING 75.67
  LVNAME Columbia
END
MSS:ProjectApollo\MSS
  STATUS Landed Earth
  POS -80.6199329 28.5953797
  HEADING 245.34
END
Floodlight:ProjectApollo\Floodlight
  STATUS Landed Earth
  POS -80.6041210 28.6082800
  HEADING 0.00
  LIGHTS 6
  LIGHT 0 51.500000 40.500000 -50.200000 3.937463 0.703367 250.000000 35
  LIGHT 1 -66.400000 41.300000 -50.200000 5.536184 0.506145 250.000000 35
  LIGHT 2 -57.900000 42.300000 54.500000 0.759218 0.261799 250.000000 35
  LIGHT 3 50.700000 39.900000 54.000000 2.293363 0.390954 250.000000 35
  LIGHT 4 50.400000 26.200000 14.900000 2.829178 1.106539 245.000000 35
  LIGHT 5 -56.500000 25.900000 -12.100000 5.719444 0.930261 245.000000 35
END
END_SHIPS
Attached Thumbnails
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Old 01-28-2020, 01:55 PM   #30
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Yes NASA did look at using S 1B's after ASTP for cargo launches and they looked at a larger CM to fly up to 6 crew to a Space Station but the shuttle was used for that. I think NASA is selling us on a stupid ideal of this gateway. The Apollo and Skylab guys got it right that too many launches cost too much so they used one launch to do missions. These Gateway guys are trying to use 5 or 6 missions when 1 could launch most of the gateway unmanned and then a manned crew could take up the last component.
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