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Old 10-07-2019, 03:06 PM   #1
Hermann Oberth
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Default Toubleshooting 2GB RAM/2x1200Mhz

Hello Folks,

I installed a minimal orbiter 2016 installation on a little netbook.
2010 P1 I works fine on it.
But 2016 make some trouble.

https://pastebin.com/ee0SqDXv
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Old 10-07-2019, 03:49 PM   #2
martins
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Hermann Oberth View Post
 Hello Folks,

I installed a minimal orbiter 2016 installation on a little netbook.
2010 P1 I works fine on it.
But 2016 make some trouble.

https://pastebin.com/ee0SqDXv
You should use the T&L graphics device. Forcing the transform and lighting calculations to be performed in software creates a huge bottleneck that will kill the frame rate.

Apart from that, can you define "some trouble"? It's not clear from the log file what goes wrong. Do inline (D3D7) graphics and D3D9 client show the same problems?
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Old 10-08-2019, 01:49 PM   #3
Hermann Oberth
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Hello Mr. Schweiger,

I am using now the T&L graphics device. But didn't change anything.

Trouble means: It does not compleete loading orbiter.
The Windows reports: "Program don't work anymore, cause of some problem.
Program will be closed and you will be informed if there is a solution available."
...
OK, I found this D3D7 client. But the problem is still the same.

Last edited by Hermann Oberth; 10-08-2019 at 01:58 PM.
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Old 10-08-2019, 02:37 PM   #4
martins
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Hermann Oberth View Post
 Trouble means: It does not compleete loading orbiter.
The Windows reports: "Program don't work anymore, cause of some problem.
Program will be closed and you will be informed if there is a solution available."
Is that all you get, or does the error message contain any more detail that might help narrowing down the problem?
Quote:
OK, I found this D3D7 client. But the problem is still the same.
Just to clarify: the D3D7 client is the one you get automatically when you run orbiter.exe. The D3D9 client is a separate module you download, and which is used in combination with orbiter_ng.exe. The D3D9 client often works better with more recent graphics hardware.

Finally, the 2GB RAM could be a problem. Did you check if the memory usage is maxing out when running Orbiter (e.g. with TaskManager or a similar resource monitor)? Memory might be even tighter if the graphics chip can reserve some of the main RAM. For testing, you could try to reduce Orbiter memory allocation by reducing the max resolution level (under the Visual effects tab) to a very small value (say 5), or by launching a scenario that starts very far away from all planetary bodies.
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Old 10-08-2019, 03:41 PM   #5
Hermann Oberth
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OK,
I reinstalled D3D9, and turned off everything possible, with a 800x600px window, using the AMSO Apollo 11 Step 9 scenario (Course correction #2 mid space), max. resolution level 5.
Quote:
>>> ERROR: DDraw error DDERR_BLTFASTCANTCLIP
[OrbiterGraphics::clbkBlt | .\OGraphics.cpp | 1633]
The Task-Manager tells me, that there are just about 650Mb left on the RAM to run OSS.
Seems that's not enough!
And yes, 1/4 of the 2Gb are occupied by the graphic-device. 1,4Gb left. 55% occupied by Win8.1.
- Nooo, I dont blame you Mr. Schweiger. I blame Mr. Gates!
I suggest somebody should write somewhere: "System requirement at least 4Gb RAM"
And perhaps I should finally buy a new laptop!
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Old 10-08-2019, 03:58 PM   #6
martins
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650MB is not a lot, but might still be enough to launch a minimal orbiter configuration, at least for testing purposes. Did you try reducing the resolution level to 5 with the same result?

You should also disable all modules in the Modules tab (except the D3D9 client).

For testing, don't use an AMSO scenario, but a simple single stock vessel scenario.

The DDERR_BLTFASTCANTCLIP error can probably be ignored for now. It shouldn't be the cause of the crash.

Did you check how much memory Orbiter itself is allocating just before it crashes? Some 3rd party tools can also monitor video memory usage, in case that is the limiting factor.

Finally, you could try running orbiter_ng.exe without loading the D3D9 client. That will only give you a command line interface if it works, but at least it will tell you if the problem is graphics/memory related, or if there is something more fundamental amiss.
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Old 10-08-2019, 07:54 PM   #7
Hermann Oberth
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Yes, the resolution level was down to 5.
All modules disabled.
I reinstall Net Framework 3.5 now, cause 2010P1 reportet some problem with it, while I tried to create some "holy-space-probe-behind-kuiper.scn"
And then I will check it with the Orbiter_ng.exe.
It is difficult to check the RAM-usage of orbiter right the moment befor the crash. It is loading for about 5sec. and then it crash.
And my 3rd-party-task-manager consumes to much RAM to run.

But honestly, it makes not much sence to launch a minimal orbiter configuration, except for testing it out.
I want go to the moon, and do the other things...!

At the moment I try with a running 2010P1 to figure out where the edge of the RAM is! -I keep you informed.

---------- Post added at 07:54 PM ---------- Previous post was at 04:45 PM ----------

I have done the installation again. Now it does a bit more.
At least I get some more Errors!

Quote:
Warning: Config not present in /Modules/server/ Please create folder
https://pastebin.com/10aKxjY8

But this page is simplifie chinese to me: http://schinagl.priv.at/nt/hardlinks....html#download

For over 6 years I had nothing to do with Orbiter. And if I try to install all this things, the programs tell me that .dll's are missing.
I dont want to mess my new Windows Installation up now.

Can anybody guide me throu this?
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Old 10-09-2019, 10:38 AM   #8
martins
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Sorry, you lost me a bit. The only error messages I can see in the log files are about source surfaces being NULL. This could either point to a faulty addon installation (missing texture files) or to memory problems (texture load fails due to memory allocation errors). Where is the warning about the missing config coming from? Did you click the "Create symbolic links" button in the D3D9 client advanced setup?

And why the link shell extension? I can't believe that you need to install a 3rd party windows extension just to create symbolic links, which surely is a core OS function. The mklink command works on all my windows machines, and I can't remember ever having to install an addon for it.

Also, which dlls are reported as missing?
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Old 10-09-2019, 09:59 PM   #9
Hermann Oberth
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Allright, finally I found that "missing-link-button", in the D3D9 client advanced setup, cause page 2 of the D3D9-manual sayed it's at video.
Quote:
And why the link shell extension? I can't believe that you need to install a 3rd party windows extension just to create symbolic links, which surely is a core OS function.
- Well, I found this page from this austrian guy, wich makes me more confused.
Just press this button!

Good. Now it is loading for about 30sec. and this warning is gone. But, it still don't work, cause windows reports: "Program don't work anymore, cause of some problem. Program will be closed and you will be informed if there is a solution available." (I wish windows really could do that!)

Orbiter log sayes: D3D9: ERROR: D3D9Client::clbkBlt() Source surface is NULL

I guess I need some spacecraft3.dll, from some guy in sibiria, wich makes himself immortalized, by programming that .dll? - Vinka was his name. Right? Or, spacecraft4.dll, spacecraft5.dll?
This little things "you need to know" doesn't make it easier for newbies, and reentries as well, to install ... and fly away!

https://pastebin.com/TfY52uyu - Actually no .dlls are missing!

Wich .dlls do I need?
...
What is vesselhooking.Dll ???

Last edited by Hermann Oberth; 10-10-2019 at 12:30 AM.
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Old 10-10-2019, 07:05 AM   #10
Ripley
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Could it be this?
C:\Users\ALF\Desktop\Orbitter 2016 Installation\
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Old 10-10-2019, 11:43 AM   #11
Hermann Oberth
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You mean I should not put the folder on the desktop?
Own partition or how...?
I installed some favorit addons yesterday, MFDs.
But i can't find spacecreft3.dll to download.

Last edited by Hermann Oberth; 10-10-2019 at 11:55 AM.
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Old 10-10-2019, 01:15 PM   #12
martins
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If you are already in the process of installing addons and spacecraft3, then I am assuming that you have got the basic Orbiter installation running now. Which means I can bow out of this thread.
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Old 10-10-2019, 05:11 PM   #13
Hermann Oberth
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No, nothing is running!
I am glad for the help, but there I haven't found spacecraft3.dll, and the other MFDs I installed didn,t make it run either. I am still working on it.
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Old 10-10-2019, 05:23 PM   #14
Ripley
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Hermann Oberth View Post
 You mean I should not put the folder on the desktop?
Own partition or how...?
I'd go for a subfolder like c:\games\orbiter

Quote:
Originally Posted by Hermann Oberth View Post
 I installed some favorit addons yesterday, MFDs. But i can't find spacecreft3.dll to download.
What about plain vanilla Orbiter, without installing anything else?
Does it run? Have you already tried that?

You can find Vinka's goodies here:
https://www.tuttovola.org/index.php?...=view;down=956



Quote:
Originally Posted by Hermann Oberth View Post
 I dont want to mess my new Windows Installation up now.
Is this a new Windows10 install?

Last edited by Ripley; 10-10-2019 at 05:28 PM.
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Old 10-10-2019, 05:41 PM   #15
Hermann Oberth
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OK, I copy the folder on C:
No, It is a new Win 8.1 installation.
What is a "plain vanilla Orbiter"?

I installed:
Orbiter2016.zip, 2.5GB
D3D9ClientR3.10-forOrbiter2016(r1162).zip
XRSound for Orbiter 2016
and a few of the highest ratet MFDs
Thats it.

I persume I have to use "VinkaSpacecraft4Pack"?

Quote:
Plain vanilla is an adjective describing the simplest version of something, without any optional extras, basic or ordinary.[1] In analogy with the common ice cream flavour vanilla, which became widely and cheaply available with the development of artificial vanillin flavour.[2] Certain financial instruments, such as put options or call options, are often described as plain vanilla options. The opposite of plain vanilla options are exotic options.
-Aha

Last edited by Hermann Oberth; 10-10-2019 at 07:36 PM.
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